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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Is God in absolut contrl over all things | Acts 4:24 | Sir Pent | 62933 | ||
Perhaps we’re at an impass .............................................. Dear John, .............................................. Tom and Jerry’s lack of legs may have been a direct result of the sin of Adam. But the sin of Adam was a direct result of God creating the universe in a way that He knew would lead to Adam’s sin. Please remember that you have already agreed in a previous post that God knowingly created a universe that WOULD be full of people who were unable to choose to love God (unless God changed their hearts). Thus Tom and Jerry’s lack of legs MUST BE BY DESIGN according to your own belief system. Therefore, the hat is straight again :) .............................................. If you are truly determined to never agree to use this analogy despite my efforts to show that it accurately reflects your belief system, then perhaps we are at an impass here after all. I regret that it is the case, however, I did commit to discussing some analogy of your own making, dealing with this issue, and will follow through with that commitment. I will try to remain open to your perspective and learn from what you present. For the sake of organization, perhaps you could add your analogy as a response to post #62527. |
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2 | Is God in absolut contrl over all things | Acts 4:24 | John Reformed | 62940 | ||
Dear Sir P, You wrote: "Tom and Jerry’s lack of legs may have been a direct result of the sin of Adam. But the sin of Adam was a direct result of God creating the universe in a way that He knew would lead to Adam’s sin." We must be carefull here lest we accuse God of being the author of sin. We both agree that He is most certainly not! He knew what the result would be of bestowing free will upon His creature, and was also aware of it's consequences on His entire creation, before He uttered "let there be light". But God did not design the universe in such a way that Adam must sin. God simply knew Adam would sin. I believe we must consider WHY God created the universe in the first place. It certainly was not because of any lack in Himself. What was the ULTIMATE end that God willed to achieve? "A subordinate end is what an agent aims at, not at all upon its own account, but wholly on the a account of a further end, of which it is considered as a means. Thus when a man goes a journey to obtain a medicine to restore his health, the obtaining of that medicine is his subordinate end; because it is not an end that he values at all upon its own account, but wholly as a means of a further end, viz. his health. Separate the medicine from that further end, and it is not at all desired." (Jonathan Edwards) What do you percieve as God's ultimate end? (It is not my intention to sidetrack our main discourse, But sometimes the quickst route is the longest way about. John |
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3 | Is God in absolut contrl over all things | Acts 4:24 | Sir Pent | 62944 | ||
The road goes 3 ways ................................................... Dear John, You said in your last post that “It is not my intention to sidetrack our main discourse, But sometimes the quickst route is the longest way about.” Unfortunately, I perceive your question about what God’s ultimate goal for the universe is, to be just that, a sidetrack. Therefore, I see three ways we could proceed on this specific part of the thread (POINT ALPHA): ................................................... Option 1. You decide that the Tom and Jerry analogy is sufficient for describing the Calvinist viewpoint of the human perspective and then explain how Jerry is making a REAL choice to not walk to the ice cream store if he doesn’t have any legs. ................................................... Option 2. You decide that you are unwilling to use the Tom and Jerry analogy for whatever reason, and therefore present your own alternative analogy, and we discuss it instead. ................................................... Option 3. You give a very clear explanation as to why in the world I should go down this side road about God’s ultimate goal for the universe. This explanation should include exactly how this relates back to the point we are talking about (whether Tom or Jerry are making a real choice). This explanation should also include why I should be redundant by discussing this subject again, when my thoughts on that exact question are already documented on another thread of this forum. (search for post #13788) |
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