Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Reighnskye | 133511 | ||
EdB, Currently in my church, my pastor teaches that the doctrine of baptism was mandated for new Jewish believers, but was not however imposed upon the Gentiles. The exact same thing went for circumcision. I fully believe that the bible clearly states that baptism (like circumcision) is absolutely necessary for salvation, as was Peter's doctrine to the Jews. However, Peter's doctrine was also exclusively directed to Jewish converts (plus Gentiles who had converted to Jusaism), up until Acts Chapter 10. Jesus went only to the lost sheep of Israel, until His divine appearance to Paul in a vision. Before this point, however, all new converts to the Gospel of Jesus also had to conform to the full requirements of the Law of Moses (baptism and circumcision included) under Peter's apostolic authority, in order to be accepted into the church. If you weren't baptized and circumcised, you were strictly excommunicated. So yes, Peter's Gospel strictly necessitated baptism. Paul's message did not. - Acts 2 38 Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. (NAS95) Acts 15 1 Some men came down from Judea and began teaching the brethren, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved." (NAS95) - Blessings, Reighnskye |
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2 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Rowdy | 133635 | ||
I'm very curious as to how you came to such a conclusion about Paul's position on baptism in light of the scriptures below. Rom 6:3 Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. 1 Cor 1:13 Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so that no one would say you were baptized in my name. 16 Now I did baptize also the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized any other. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not in cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made void. 1 Cor 10:2 and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. 1 Cor 15:29 Otherwise, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why then are they baptized for them? Gal 3:27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism, Col 2:12 having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. I understand there are some controversies about this topic of baptism but it seems to me that Paul's being a strong advocate of baptism is NOT one of them. If by chance you're referring to Paul's position about the focus of his ministery as mentioned in 1 Cor 1:17, I think there's a simple explanation. Human beings have a tendancy to want to be baptized by someone famous. My own father was baptized by a christian preacher who had a show on television many years ago and is now dead. But people all over the world brag about being taught and/or baptized by a famous christian who perhaps is on television or has written a book of some sort. In the first century, obviously Paul was getting some of this same kind of notariety along with Apollos and Peter. Here Paul is trying to de-emphasize himself and promote Christ and His sacrifice on the cross instead. IMO, Paul recognized he had a big job to do, preach the Gospel throughout the whole world and a short time to do it in. So naturally he prioritized his life into preaching the Gospel and let others take care of details like baptizing those that wanted to become christians. I hope this helps clarify the issue. God bless. Rowdy |
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3 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Reighnskye | 133790 | ||
Rowdy, I have not so much suggested that Paul was not an advocate of baptism. Indeed Paul was an advocate of the entire Law of Moses, and preached wholly in it's support. However, he did not view the Law so much as the vehicle of salvation. I apologize for coming late into this thread, insofar as my focus had been in other threads, and I seldom venture into threads that have been running for a long time, unless I was involved with them in their early stages. I would like to better understand your position. Are you saying that water baptism is a requirement of salvation, and that a person will be eternally damned if they are not water baptized? Again, as per the many verse references that you gave, we clearly see that Paul was a staunch advocate of baptism, even as he greatly supported obedience to the Law of Moses. The practice of baptism originated from Old Testament Law, with the ceremonial cleansing of the priests. While Peter and James may have advocated a strict Law obedience (for example, circumcision) to be members of the church, it doesn't seem that Paul was so strict with the Gentiles. Perhaps he was with the Jews. - Romans 7 12 So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good. (NAS95) - Blessings, Reighnskye |
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4 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Rowdy | 133837 | ||
"I would like to better understand your position. Are you saying that water baptism is a requirement of salvation, and that a person will be eternally damned if they are not water baptized?" In response to your question above, I can only quote just one of the scriptures that applies. Mark 16:16 "He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned. As I understand the scriptures here, the Lord is very clear. The word "and" is a conjuction which marries the two verbs "believe" and "be baptized." I realize not everyone endorses this interpretation but there are many millions throughout the world that do. I futher understand it's not a popular concept with the Forum or the Lockman Foundation as evidenced by the famous "Note to Viewers" hereunder. I can only quote from the scriptures and comply with their simple message. I would also re-introduce to you the verses below in what I call the Lord's principle of "better safe than sorry." Matt 5:29 "If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 "If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell. I hope this helps in clarifying the issue. God bless. Rowdy |
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5 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Reighnskye | 133991 | ||
Rowdy, I in no way dispute the veracity of either Mark 16:16 or Acts 2:38, as being fully applicable upon the early Jewish church. - Mark 16 16 "He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned. (NAS95) Mark 16 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (KJV) Acts 2 38 Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. (NAS95) Acts 2 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (KJV) - Where we may differ, perhaps, is the applicability of these verses upon the Gentile churches under Paul. I view water baptism as an Old Testament practice, much like maintaining the Sabbath or being circumcised. These are all ordinances that the early Jewish church, under the authority of Peter and James, was quick to conform to. If anyone did not conform to these ordinances, they would likely be quickly excommuncated from the early Jewish church. Would it not be fair to say that water baptism is an Old Testament ordinance, that originates from the Law of Moses? Baptism originated as a ceremonial cleansing from the Old Testament priests, and was also practiced by John the Baptist (apt name here), prior to the formation of the early Jewish church. In fact, Jesus himself conformed to water baptism. John the Baptist, at the age of thirty, and as a descendent of Zacharias, now had authority to baptize the Savior, in accordance with Jewish Law. I have other scriptures to present to you, but I'm trying to figure out where your general beliefs are on a few issues first, so I may potentially offer appropriate scriptures. - Blessings, Reighnskye |
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6 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Rowdy | 133996 | ||
I would refer you to my recent Post No 133984 and the one just under it to Tim Moran. I'm convinced that baptism is required of all who want to be assured of their salvation before Judgment Day. Also, I would refer you to the sum total picture from the 87 verses on the matter of baptism found throughout the NT. After reading all these posts and the 87 verses, I'd be interested in discussing with you your response. God bless. Rowdy |
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7 | Baptism-What Does the Bible Teach? | Acts 2:38 | Reighnskye | 134241 | ||
Rowdy, Thanks. I got a chance to read the post that you mentioned. I've also had opportunity over the years to read the many verses on baptism that the bible provides, assuming that these are the 87 verses that you are referring to. What I'll probably do is jump in on some of your future posts, rather than do a full reading of the previous ones, as my time frame may reasonably allot. Perhaps in that way, I can catch myself up to speed, with what you're saying. - Blessings, Reighnskye |
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