Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | charis | 66744 | ||
Dear retxar, Greetings in the name of Jesus! My friend, that is pretty negative! :-) You have Scriptures, but they are ineffective? I await your 'best shot!' :-) Please don't misunderstand me about 1 Corinthians 7:14. I do not consider it a 'proof text.' I only say that it could bring comfort to us that our children are under 'special consideration' for a 'season.' I don't think of it as salvation, per se, unless they are taken by the Lord before their own time of calling. I believe that my girls were in the Lord's care until they came to know Him on their own. If they were rebellious and recalcitrant through high school, never honoring parents or God, I would indeed fear for their lives! So, no, I don't think your 'all-children-since-Noah' is viable. Now, to your scenario: Are all children saved until a 'time of reckoning (responsibility)?' What sin must be committed in order to lose that salvation? When? So, are saved adults either saved-lost-saved or saved-saved, or are they just predestined-saved? And the lost are saved-lost (when?), or born-saved-but-predestined-lost? Or, is anyone lost at all? (this is getting REALLY confusing! :-)) My fellow forumer, I readily admit that I do not have all the answers. I try my best to stay within the basic perimeters of the Bible without undue emotional conjecture. I would LIKE for all kids to be saved, but I have a hard time understanding God's rationale for 'unsaving' them. If sin is the reason for losing my childhood salvation, then I know I am not worthy of 'renewed' salvation. If my 'choice' got me saved after being lost after childhood salvation, then only those in the correct circumstances can be saved. For there are many that don't have the various 'choices' laid out before them. Which kind of brings us back to God chose me, by grace, because I KNOW I was lost! Thank you, too, for the fellowship. Why don't you give those Scriptures a try? Maybe they are more effective than you think! :-) Blessings and peace in Christ Jesus, charis |
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2 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | retxar | 66837 | ||
Sorry if I came across as negative. Here’s another shot! Mar 10:14 such is the kingdom of heaven Mar 10:15 receive kingdom as a little child Luk 18:16 such is the kingdom of heaven Luk 18:17 receive kingdom as a little child Mat 18:3 become as little children Mat 19:14 such is the kingdom of heaven And they were bringing children (children of many) to Him so that He might touch them; but the disciples rebuked them (definitely not the disciples children). But when Jesus saw this, He was indignant and said to them, "Permit the children (any of the children) to come to Me; do not hinder them; for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these (no regard to who their parents were). "Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child (as a child, not any particular child) will not enter it at all." And He took them in His arms and began blessing them, laying His hands on them. (Mar 10:13-16) These children here in Mark were NOT the disciples children. Jesus did not care who’s children they were. Jesus declared that they possessed heaven with no regard of who their mom and dad were. Jesus gave no hint that any of the children’s heavenly status was questionable. You state that you have a hard time understanding God's rationale for 'un-saving' children and that seems to be a problem for you to believe that ALL young children are secure, even tho you feel that should be right. Then you go on to say that there was a time when you KNOW you were lost. I assume that when you were born you also KNOW (now anyway) your were saved (secure). Hey, I believe the same thing for my own life! I believe I was secure/lost/saved! I know I am probably misunderstanding what you meant and please, please don’t think I am trying to twist your words, but it seems you have said the same thing (secure/lost/saved). Could this mean that what you KNOW is not necessarily what you understand? I do not pretend to understand either! retxar |
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3 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | charis | 66854 | ||
Dear retxar, Greetings in Jesus' name! Friend, Maybe you were right not to post these Scriptures. :-) Maybe my English is getting rusty, but I was under the impression that 'as' and 'such as' meant 'to the same degree or amount, for instance, in the way or manner that,' etc., but did not equate the example with the subject. In other words, the child or children were used as the example of the manner in which we pursue the kingdom of God. So far, every commentary I have studied says the same thing. Now, you'l have to trust that I came up with my thinking on my own, and just recently (this thread) sought out the combined wisdom of much more able scholars than me. Please do not accuse me of following tradition, that would not 'stick' on me! :-) Perhaps these commentaries are all wrong, and indeed the original words of the Lord meant to include the child-children used for example. Then you have revelation I do not. As to the children in Mark definitely NOT being the disciple's children, I guess you mean that disciples would never rebuke their own children? :-) Or perhaps the disciple's children would never need rebuke? Indeed, heavenly children. :-) I agree that the Lord gives us no idea whatsoever of all children's heavenly status. As to secure-lost-saved, I don't think I was secure as an infant or child. My observation is that children are very insecure, unless every need is met! :-) Sure, we have this image of a contented babe-in-arms, but in the light of reality, children are cranky and upset and willful UNLESS they are fed, changed, warm (but not too warm), AND constantly ensconced in their mother's arms. Perhaps I have only seen the 'colicky' babies? :-) Please don't misunderstand me, my forum fellow, I do not feel it is 'right' for all children to be saved; my emotions feel it would be 'fair.' Big difference. If God were in the business of being 'fair' by human emotional standards, then the only people sent to hell would be those YOU (or another) thought deserved it! If this is the case, then is God listening (obeying) YOUR viewpoint, or another person's viewpoint? Or will God judge by 'majority-rules' or 'popular-vote?' I tend to trust that God is righteous, even if He condemns some that I 'feel' are innocent, or even if He saves some I 'feel' are unworthy. Please note, dear retxar, that I have not said that I am convinced that all children of the unsaved are in hell if they died before they had their 'chance.' I have only stated that the Bible gives us no clear assurance that they are in heaven. So far, you have not provided me with a convincing argument that would supercede the opinion of the many scholars I have studied. "I know not why God's wondrous grace to me He hath made known, nor why, unworthy, Christ in love redeemed me for His own. But I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I've committed unto Him against that day." D.W.Whittle (2 Timothy 1:12) Thank you for responding to my questions, and giving me your view on this issue. Blessings to you and yours in Christ Jesus, charis |
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4 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | retxar | 66882 | ||
Charis, I know this is where this exchange was supposed to end, but I have 2 small issues with your last post that I fell I must address and then I will cease. 1. You wrote: “Please do not accuse me of following tradition, that would not 'stick' on me! :-)” What brought this on? I re-read my posts, and am at a loss as to what you are talking about? Are you sure I was the one that said what you thought I said to prompt this response from you? Anyway, I apologize to you, sir, if you thought I implied this in anyway. I promise, the thought (of you following tradition) never crossed my mind! 2. Your comments that I was assuming too much to determine the children were NOT the disciple’s: If you would examine the text carefully, you are sure to agree with me too! The ones who were rebuked were not the children, as you have assumed, rather the ones rebuked were the ones who brought them! “Then they brought little children to Him, that He might touch them; but the disciples rebuked those who brought them.” (Mar 10:13 NKJV). So unless Jesus was rebuking the disciples for rebuking themselves, I think it is safe to say the children were not their own. retxar |
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5 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | charis | 66885 | ||
Dear retxar, Greetings in the name of Jesus! 10 Friend, no apologies are demanded at all! I was simply making a rhetorical statement to preclude the possibility that I was following the tradional (the commentaries) viewpoint. Truly, I was not implying that YOU were accusing me. I am sorry that it came out wrong. Though we are holding a 'conversation,' it is on a public forum, and some might think I was only parroting the commentators. The 'won't stick' part was a joke, because few that know me could accuse me of holding to 'tradition.' Again, my fellow saint, this was not directed to you, and I am the one to apologize. 2) I stand corrected. That particular passage is clear that it is not the disciple's children. I did not check this out before posting. Nonetheless, these children were probably those of 'seekers of Jesus,' as it is implied that they were still 'in the house' that Jesus was staying in while the region of Judea by the other side of the Jordan (vs. 10:1 and 10:10). It seems unlikely that they were non-Jews or even the children of the Pharisees, so I came to the conclusion that they were the children of 'followers' of Christ, but not 'capital-D' Disciples, who did the rebuking, and received a rebuke for it! Sorry for the slip! (blushing with shame!) Brother (I think! When ARE you going to give a user profile?!?!), I am not being facetious or pugnacious in any way. Really! I've lived in Japan the majority of my life, speak Japanese all day long, eat Japanese food, and even sometimes translate my words Japanese to English in my writing. Though educated in English, it is sometimes like a second language, not my first. I apologize if my (weird, misplaced) humor is not understandable. I'll try harder in the future! Blessings and peace in Christ Jesus, charis |
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6 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | retxar | 66891 | ||
Thanks Charis, No ploblem here, I just wanted to be sure I didn't say something I did not mean. You be right, I be a bro also! I'll try to do that profile thing soon! I was wondering how long before that came up! later bro! retxar |
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7 | Do all little ones believe? | Matt 18:6 | charis | 66898 | ||
Deal Blo lextal, Grad thele's no ploblem! (solly, courdn;t herp myserf!) ;-) In Christ Jesus, charis |
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