Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | Morant61 | 142567 | ||
Greetings Apologia315! Though there are many who feel that Is. 14:12-14 is a reference to Satan, they are simply wrong. Is. 14:1-23 is simply a song or taunt that the nation of Israel will sing against Babylon. The central figure is a real king, not Satan. The context makes this clear. Let's look at the verses in question. Verse one speaks of Israel being settled in her own land again. When did this occur? It took place after her captivity. Who held her captive? Her captor was Babylon! Verse two says that Israel will make captive her captors and rule over her oppressors. Verse four begins the taunt that Israel will raise up against Babylon. Verses 9 through 15 simply make the point that the king of Babylon will die as do all mortal men. Who are the captives in v. 17? Israel was among those captives. Verse 23 fortells the destruction of Babylon. There simply isn't any reason to see this passage as a reference to Satan. I hope this helps! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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2 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | Pastor Glenn | 142598 | ||
Hello Brother Tim, I have great respect for your posts, but I wanted to point out that other scriptures are also addressing individuals, as well as, Satan. When Satan is indwelling a person, God has addressed both of them in the same passages: Gen 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Notice how dialog directed to the serpent in verse 14 is quickly redirected to Satan in verse 15. We see this again in Ezekiel 28, as well as, in John 13:27. Joh 13:27 And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly. Matthew 16:23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Any comments? Your brother in Christ, Pastor Glenn |
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3 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | Morant61 | 142601 | ||
Greetings Pastor Glenn! It is good to hear from you my friend and fellow pastor! :-) In most of the examples you cited, Satan was the motivating factor behind an action. So, for instance, in the case of Peter, I'm not sure that Jesus was really addressing Satan as much as Peter. The Ezekiel 28 passage is different. It is clearly speaking of a human being for a time, but then the language changes to things that are clearly not true of any human being. This is why almost all accept that Satan is being addressed in Ez. 28. But, this is no the case in Is. 14. Satan is never mentioned, and all of the details perfectly fit the human ruler of Babylon. So, I personally would not add him into the picture in Is. 14. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | mark d seyler | 142603 | ||
Hi Tim and Glenn, How does this describe the king of Babylon? Isa 14:13-14 And thou saidst in thy heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; and I will sit upon the mount of congregation, in the uttermost parts of the north; I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High. Everything I read of the king of Babylon, at Babylon's overthrow, says he had no regard for God, and the Babylonians rather worshipped their own gods. If I simply read this passage as the Bible presents it, it seems easy to understand. If we say that this passage is unable to be properly understood without bringing in extra-biblical mythology, do we do justice to the Word of God? Shall we say that we cannot properly understand the scripture by simply reading it, but that to really know what God is saying to us we must have both the Bible, and Canaanite mythology? For that matter, do we actually know that the Canaanite story does not also depict Satan's fall? If I see the fallen one as Satan, then this correlates to Luke 10:18 as Jesus says "I saw Satan fall from heaven. . ." Isa 14:24-25 Jehovah of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely, as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand: that I will break the Assyrian in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulder. This has often been understood to be a prophecy of the antichrist, indwelt by Satan, whom God will destroy in Isreal. The Babylonians were never destroyed in Isreal. Just some thoughts. . . Love in Christ, Mark |
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5 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | Morant61 | 142604 | ||
Greetings Mark! To what mythology and extra-biblical sources are you referring? I was arguing that Is. 14 simply refers to a human king! :-) Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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6 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | mark d seyler | 142605 | ||
Hi Tim, I'm sorry, I had also read Kalos' post, and I think I just assumed that what he had said about the Canaanite thing was also your reasoning of how these verses apply to a man. My bad! :( What I don't understand is how this 'taunt' of "You said 'I will be like the Most High'" and so on, would apply to a man who was "praising the gods of gold and silver and wood and stone." Love in Christ, Mark |
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7 | Isaiah 14 - Lucifer's people? | Is 14:12 | Morant61 | 142606 | ||
Greetings Mark! Many feel that Is. 14 refers to Senecrib (sp?). If you read Is. 37, he boasted to Ezekiel that no foreign god had been able to stop him. So, the taunt may have simply been refering to his desire to be over the God of Israel. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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