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NASB | Romans 11:22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Romans 11:22 Then appreciate the gracious kindness and the severity of God: to those who fell [into spiritual ruin], severity, but to you, God's gracious kindness--if you continue in His kindness [by faith and obedience to Him]; otherwise you too will be cut off. |
Subject: cut off |
Bible Note: I agree with most of what you have said. Let me respond to a couple... (and please understand that I don't necessarily hold all of these as personal beliefs, but I am postulating for the sake of debate): You: "The commission of our saviour in Mark 16:15 "And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." is still valid today. Even a Calvinist cannot pick out those who are chosen and those who are not." Me: I agree that God has invited us to be part of His purposes. This alone does not deny that the people we encounter may be part of the "elect". You are right, we can't pick out the elect, thus we are called to go to the ends of the earth spreading the Gospel. But this doesn't mean that God doesn't have them picked out. You: "I understand the theory of 5 point Calvinism. I have difficulty reconciling this theory with free choice." Me: While free choice seems right to us, I can find many more Scriptures regarding "the elect, predestined, chosen" etc than I can on "free will". You: "However, he will not go back on his word now." Me: I agree, God doesn't go back on His word. In fact, listen to the Scripture: Romans 11 26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. 27 And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins." 28 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your account; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29 for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. This seems to say that, in spite of the hardness of Israel, God will save them because He promised... they were numbered among the elect based on God's promise alone... seemingly in spite of their bad free-will choice. And then there is this... Romans 9 9 For this was how the promise was stated: "At the appointed time I will return, and Sarah will have a son." 10 Not only that, but Rebekah's children had one and the same father, our father Isaac. (A very interesting verse!): 11 Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad--in order that God's purpose in election might stand: 12 not by works but by him who calls--she was told, "The older will serve the younger." 13 Just as it is written: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." 14 What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! 15 For he says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion." 16 It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. This seems to say that salvation is based solely on God's sovereignty, not our actions. Or this... Romans 8 26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groans that words cannot express. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints in accordance with God's will. 28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. 29 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified. This seems to say that even what is in our heart comes from the Spirit and, without the intercession of the Spirit, we would be lost. I understand and struggle as you do with the "robot problem". But I also want to submit myself to God's sovereignty. In the final analysis, it is His way, not the way I wish it was (whether elect or free will). Finally, I don't think that the Great Commission and election are necessarily mutually exclusive. God can use us to accomplish His purposes, even if His purposes are pre-known to Him. Otherwise, I think I'll let those verses stand on their own for a while. Blessings! Curt |