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NASB | Mark 4:16 "In a similar way these are the ones on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with joy; |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | Mark 4:16 "In a similar way these [in the second group] are the ones on whom seed was sown on rocky ground, who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with joy [but accept it only superficially]; |
Bible Question:
Hello members! Hope all is well! It's great to be saved! All glory be to God, and praise to His Son Jesus who died for the sins of the world! I know that there has been a lot of discussion on the forum regarding the loss of salvation and falling away. I have been giving this a lot of thought lately and would like to ask another question about this. What exactly is "fallen away"? and, Was Paul saying in Heb 6:6 that we could not return to Jesus? I would like to see some more discussion around this. When David and Moses sinned had they fallen away? When Peter denied Jesus and when he had to be corrected by Paul was he fallen away? or, Is satan, his demons, and his followers the description of fallen away? In one of my previous posts, in answer to a question regarding Heb 6:6, I responded that no person, not even a christian, can win some one who has fallen away back to repentance but the fallen away person could only be brought back in by the working of the Holy Spirit. Was this not a good interpretation of this verse? What about the church in Rev 2:5 below, is this the description of fallen away or was Paul reffering to something different in Heb 6:6? Rev 2:4 'But I have this against you, that you have left your first love. Rev 2:5 'Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place--unless you repent. What about Luke 9:51-56? Luke 9:55 But He turned and rebuked them, [and said, "You do not know what kind of spirit you are of; Luke 9:56 for the Son of Man did not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them."] And they went on to another village. This is not an attempt to draw any one into debate. I do, however, appreciate the postings from you members of the forum and would like to ask you to comment just this one more time on the subject of fallen away. Always your brother in Christ, Cyclist PS I'm sorry to read that Zach left the forum. GOD BLESS YOU Zach! |
Bible Answer: Cyclist: Welcome back. Haven't seen you in a while! You wrote: "In one of my previous posts, in answer to a question regarding Heb 6:6, I responded that no person, not even a christian, can win some one who has fallen away back to repentance but the fallen away person could only be brought back in by the working of the Holy Spirit. Was this not a good interpretation of this verse?" I think it is a stretch, because the verse really seems to indicate that the way back would be barred if someone would actually fall away. Since our salvation is a work of the Holy Spirit in the first place, it is always impossible for Christians (on their own strength, wisdom, etc.) to win anyone to Christ in the first place apart from the Holy Spirit's direct intervention in the sinner's heart. It is remotely possible that such an interpretation could hold, but there really doesn't seem to be any evidence that that is what the inspired writer is saying. You also wrote about the churches in Revelation. i think that this is a very good passage to examine in light of the "eternal security" debate. First of all, the congregation as a whole is being addressed as a church, rather than as a group of individual believers. It seems to me what Christ is telling most of these churches is that because they are fulfilling their corporate role as a transforming presence for the kingdom of God, that Christ is going to remove His presence from among them. I see a great number of parallels in our churches today in the United States. How many congregations fit the description of being lukewarm or unfocused on Christ or reluctant to proclaim the whole counsel of God or more interested in church socials than reaching the lost or missions? Now there are undoubtedly true followers of Christ in most or all of these churches, but I am fearful that Christ will be removing his lampstand from the evangelical church in the United States precisely because we are no longer faithfully finishing the redemptive work that Christ commissioned us to take part in. However, I do not think it means that everyone in those churches will suddenly lose their salvation. Christ has largely abandoned the great churches in Europe after they abandoned His commission and His truth. The judgment will be the same for our churches here unless we return to our first love as well. God's kindgom will never perish, but He has never promised that the United States will remain a major player in world evangelization. We need to get on our knees and grieve and repent for the extremely poor stewardship of time and resources and other blessings that God has bestowed upon us that we may glorify Him. --Joe! |