Results 21 - 30 of 30
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Results from: Notes Author: seeking4truth Ordered by Verse |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
21 | Ken, are you sure? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101545 | ||
Well, I'm not so sure, Ken. You wrote: "It's always been a "blood" demand with God." I've posted verses that seem to speak to the contrary. But we all tend to believe what we want to believe. Again, that is what much of these threads are about in this topic - that WE pick and choose which verses we want to hold to and which ones we want to reason away or ignor. To me, this smacks of the same sin that brought humanity's downfall in the first place - "Did God REALLY say...?" And I am not so sure about the statement of only innocent blood standing in the presence of God either. Jesus was, as I understand it, righteous, not innocent. Innocent denotes not knowing right or wrong (as Adam and Eve were before the fall). Righteous denotes a positive component of moral perfection, not innocence. But these are the fallible thoughts of a fallen creature (myself). seeking4truth |
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22 | Ken, are you sure? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101552 | ||
No thanks. I'll let someone else begin. seeking4truth |
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23 | Ken, are you sure? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101553 | ||
Ken, okay, Jesus was innocent. I agree. That was a good, solid argument. I couldn't argue with that. Nor will I. You win. :) Have fun. seeking4truth |
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24 | Ken, are you sure? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101561 | ||
No, I'm still seeking. And I always will be. But *I* determine what I'm seeking, you don't. I simply don't wish to argue with you. That's all. seeking4truth |
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25 | I'm skeptical | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101574 | ||
Hi BradK, I do appreciate your concern and thanks for caring. But I am in a place right now where (I know this is going to sound sacriligeous) quoting key scriptures just doesn't help me very much. Why? Isn't it because I don't believe the scriptures? Well, yes and no. I believe the scriptures are from God and are therefore infallible. But I don't believe that we interpret them infallibly. I know that I don't. I've been wrong so many times (while claiming to know for absolute certainty) that I no longer trust myself. And everytime I would have sworn that it was the Holy Spirit revealing truth to me. For example, I could list about 8 verses that seem to say that a person can lose their salvation. I could list about 8 that seem to say that salvation is eternal. I could list about 6 that seem to say that salvation is a progressive process. And I could list about 6 that seem to say that it is an event. So it is difficult for me to know what truth is anymore. That is why I am seeking it and what others may say about it. The beauty of a forum like this is it encourages us to look at more than one passage of scripture and to consider more than one viewpoint. I have a philosophy (and I admit that this may be wrong) that truth cannot be known UNTIL all the passages of scripture concerning a certain topic have been considered and there is no contradiction between them. Unfortunately, I find that Christians can (and do) argue about almost every doctrine and each one has their "pet" verses they use to substantiate their view. If you will find my post about Jesus' criteria for being a believer, you will see what I mean. (Sorry I don't have the link) But Jesus listed criteria for believers in Mark 16 that I just don't meet. So by His own words, I am not a believer (at least, not in the sense that He requires). I tend to think that I believe in Jesus like I believe in Abraham Lincoln. He lived, He died, He ascended, He will return. But I do not speak in tongues, pick up serpents, drink poison, heal the sick, thread on scorpions nor can my faith move an anthill, let alone a mountain. So by Jesus' own estimation and definition, I am not a believer. And I don't know if I ever will have that kind of faith in Him to do those things. I know, that makes me not worthy of the kingdom. What can I do? I guess all I can do is to trust that He sees my heart and that somehow His grace will be sufficient for me when it is all said and done. Thanks again for caring, BradK. If I relied on ONLY John 17:3 and 1 John 5:11-13, I might have some hope. But I know way too many other passages that say that I must endure to the end to be saved, or that I must be baptized to be saved, or that even acknowledging that He is Lord AND doing some of the miracles that He listed as signs of true believers is not enough. He still says to depart from Him. All I can do is to be like Job and say that though He slay me, yet I'll have to trust that His judgement is right. seeking4truth |
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26 | Christ and Christians? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101582 | ||
Ken, ***Did you follow this one: John 3:7 (NASB) "...... 'You must be born again.' Yes, I thought I did. But I also found this one: Matthew 5:48 - "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect." Think being born again is hard, try this one. Ouch. Sorry, no can do. Yet it is Jesus' imperative command, isn't it? seeking4truth |
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27 | Insufficient grace? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101632 | ||
Justme, ***"I have wondered if we said don't introduce anyone to Christ unless you are willing to either disciple or get someone else to keep this "new creation in Christ" growing. Any thoughts?" Yessir, I have a thought (I'm alotted one per week): You are dangerously close to agreeing with me. Beware! :) I didn't go into it in my last tirade, but a Bible was slapped into my hands without: 1. Anyone offering me a place to start. 2. Anyone showing me a few good principles of Bible study. 3. Anyone giving me any sort of history as to how we got the Bible. 4. Anyone helping me to understand the differences between the Old Testament (Covenant) and the New. 5. Anyone helping me to learn to compare scripture with scripture. 6. Anyone helping me to understand HOW the Holy Spirit teaches us from God's Word. 7. Anyone showing me what the proper role is concerning God's written Word in my life. I was simply a number by which to judge the effectiveness of a church's VBS program. That's enough for now. I don't want to lay too much blame at "Anyone's" feet. I was simply told to read the Bible. To me at that age, it was analogous to handy me a Chilton's Repair Manual and telling me to read it in order to repair a car. I had no context of where to begin and where to go. And the Elizabethian English made it that much harder. So your post is most welcome to me, justme. We have a similar heartbeat. "People want to know that you care before they will care what you know." seeking4truth |
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28 | Did Jesus teach hate? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101655 | ||
I appreciate your post. It does help to put some things into perspective. It is just a struggle to understand why Jesus said and did some of the things that He said and did giving the general consensus of Him and His ministry. For instance, though He is the Prince of Peace, He claimed to bring a sword and to divide. It takes much time, patience, and humbleness to truly understand this God-man. seeking4truth |
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29 | What is "born again?" | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101699 | ||
Ken, as far as I know. I'd like to hear your take on being "born again." seeking4truth |
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30 | Insufficient grace? | Luke 14:26 | seeking4truth | 101710 | ||
Oops, we must be discussing something that is a no-no here at SBF. I've noticed that this thread has been turned off for viewing. Well, thanks again to everyone who has responded to my controverial posts and wild ideas. I appreciate all of you who had something truthful and encouraging to say, even if I disagreed or if it stung a little bit. Grace and peace to you all. seeking4truth |
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