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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Is Belief in the Trinity Required? | Bible general Archive 4 | Holmes | 230222 | ||
Hi Beja, You wrote: “With regards to the Christ question you are going to have to clarify. In my ears you are saying contradictory remarks. They are acknowledging that Jesus is God yet not equal? You'd have to explain in what sense He is God and in what sense He is not equal. To me you are saying, lets begin with assuming there is a square circle. I can't get around the assumptions of the case in order to be able to answer you.” In what sense is Jesus God? I don’t think there is any disagreement here. In what sense is Jesus not equal to the Father? In the sense that Jesus stated this Himself and that He has a God and that God is His Father. Are there any scriptures that state that the Father or Holy Spirit have a God? Can you admit that some may read these verses and conclude that God the Father is greater than Jesus the Son, who is also God? Was Jesus making a contradictory remark and assuming there is a square circle? John: 14:28 “I go to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.” John: 20:17 “I ascend to My Father and your Father, and My God and your God.” Ephesians 1:3 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" and again in verse 17: "That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him." I hope this helps you get around the assumptions so that you can answer the question, that is, must one believe that God the Father and Jesus are equal to gain salvation? Holmes |
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2 | Is Belief in the Trinity Required? | Bible general Archive 4 | Morant61 | 230279 | ||
Greetings Holmes! I have been trying to catch up on this thread. :) It seems to me that many forget the incarnation when discussion the question of equality. Scripture makes it clear that Jesus is fully God in every sense of the word, but His status changed during the incarnation. He 'emptied Himself' and 'became a servant'. During this time, His Father was greater than He. His Father was His God, because He Himself was fully man. But, these situation only existed during the incarnation. P.S. - I am in agreement with Beja. I believe that no one comes to salvation with a full understanding of the Trinity. So, in that sense, it is not necessary for salvation. But, any view that demeans Jesus is heresy and should be rejected. Thus, as a believer submits to Scripture, he or she will come to recognize the Trinity. As an individual, I could not say that someone who rejects the Trinity is not saved, but I can say that he or she is a false teacher. Great discussion. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | Is Belief in the Trinity Required? | Bible general Archive 4 | Holmes | 230283 | ||
Hi Tim, It is an interesting argument that God the Father was only the God of the Lord Jesus Christ during a 33-year span while Jesus was alive as a man. Also, that this is the only time that God the Father was greater than the Son. Sounds like they were “co-equal” except when they weren’t. However, I do not see this supported by scripture. John 6:38 “For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.” This was, of course, pre-incarnate and clearly shows a line of authority from the Father to the Son. 1 Corinthians 11:3 “But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ. This is post-incarnate and the line of authority remains. I see the relationship between the Father and the Son as constant. And when Christ was here, he was “God with us.” None of this diminishes Christ one iota. What brings Him honor and praise is His absolute submission to the Father. This is the lesson for us, the path that Christ followed is the one we are to follow. Holmes |
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