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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | The one true God? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 98057 | ||
This is a question for the Greek scholars on the forum as I continue to study 1 John 5:6,7. I was comparing 1 John 5:6 with 1 John 5:20 today. How can we gain consistency in translation and also a true interpretation of these verses? Take note that the newest NASB translation has a change in 1 John 5:6. Any comment on that change? From the heart, Ray |
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2 | The one true God? | 1 John 5:6 | Morant61 | 98064 | ||
Greetings Ray! As far as the interpretation of the two verses, I don't really see any difference (other than I would capitalize both). 'Outos' is tricky to translate into English. Sometimes, it almost functions as personal pronoun. If one wanted to be completly consistent, I would say to always translate it as 'This one'. But, personally, I like the way the NIV handles v. 20, by translating it as 'He'. My basic rule is that in verses like v. 6, where 'outos' is followed by a substative participle, to translate it as 'This is the one who...' or 'This is the One Who'. In cases like v. 20, where 'outos' basically serves as a personal pronoun, I would agree on translating it as 'He'. But, I wouldn't have any problem with a more consistent approach either! :-) It is just hard sometimes to put Greek into smooth English and be 'woodenly' literal at all times. :-) p.s. - What was the change in the newest NASB? Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | The one true God? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 98161 | ||
Hi Tim, Thanks for talking with me. The change that I spoke of in the newest NASB was exchanging "one" for "One" for 1 John 5:6. When I was working on my personal copy I had made that change already before the newest NASB copyright. But in considering this thread, I am ready to think of putting it back in the lower case. I am thinking of putting "One" back to the old NASB copyright lower case "one" for these reasons. 1) Consistency in translation of verses 6 and 20. "This is the one who came by water and blood" and "This is the one true God and eternal life." 2) The Spirit is not an "it". I would interpret 1 John 5:7 as "And the Spirit is the One witnessing, because the Spirit is the truth." Or possibly, "And the Spirit is the one witnessing, because the Spirit is the Truth." We know that the Son of God has come into the world, and [He] has given us understanding, in order that we might know the One who is true. And we are in the true One, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the one true God. 1 John 5:20 From the heart, Ray |
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4 | The Spirit or spirit?The Truth or truth? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 122623 | ||
Hi everyone, This is a revisit to 1 John 5:6 and I hope to discuss who or what the s(Spirit) is. I hope to suggest a consistent reading for 1 John 5:6 and 20. I hope to discuss with you possible readings and interpretations of the passage so that you can decide for yourselves whether you include verse 8 in your personal copies or not. 1 John 5:6, "This is the One who [This one is He, or This is He] who came by water and blood." 1 John 5:20, "This [one] is the true God and life eternal." 1 John 5:20, NASB, "This is the true God and eternal life." 1 John 5:20, NKJ, "This is the one true God and eternal life." My point then is that we can make "outos" in verse 6 and 20 as being interpreted "This one" or "This is". 2) The Spirit is not an "it". Here in 1 John 5:7 the word "outos" is not present but rather we have the word "ho" which is the definite article in the Greek which is often made a pronoun of "(h)He" [or the (o)One]. 1 John 5:6 has been interpretted now by the NASB as reading "This is the One" and I agree with that reading. For verse 7 we have that same "ho" for "And the Spirit is "ho" who witnesses." The Interlinear Greek copies that I have available to me all have the literal reading of "And the Spirit is the One witnessing". That is why I call into question the reading of both the NASB and NKJ for verse 7. 1 John 5:7, NASB, "And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is the truth." 1 John 5:7, NKJ, "And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is truth." I don't agree with the Spirit being called an "it". Also, I point out the difference between the two translations concerning "the truth" and "truth". I will be asking you whether the (s)Spirit is the truth, the Truth or truth. I believe that a look at John 8:32 would be in order here. Also, "who is the (w)Way, the (t)Truth, and the (l)Life?" From the heart, Ray |
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5 | The Spirit or spirit?The Truth or truth? | 1 John 5:6 | Searcher56 | 122646 | ||
Why are you continuing the thread? These verses have other threads. Please read them. The Spirit is the Holy Spirit. End of discussion. | ||||||
6 | The Spirit or spirit?The Truth or truth? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 122668 | ||
Hi Searcher56, I am a little disappointed that you do not want to discuss this any more. I did read a few other threads from a "Search" and perhaps we can go to #36955 where the poster offers a definition of god. Childofaking and glory777 are searchers in that thread. But I still have not heard from you about what you think of god? Is god the same as God? Is an angel(a spirit being), the same as the Angel? Which comparison of Scriptures would you go with? John 1:1, NWT, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with (God), and the Word was a god. This **one was in the beginning with God." John 1:1, NASB, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with (God), and the Word was God. This **One was in the beginning with God." Do you agree with the Jehovah's Witness that **"he", (this god), was in the beginning with God? 1) You wrote "The Spirit is the Holy Spirit". So I agree. End of discussion. 2) However, is a [the]spirit the Holy Spirit? Is god the one, holy God? Is there room for any more discussion on these questions with you? 3) 1 John 5:5, NASB, "And who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that (Jesus) is the Son of God? 6 This is the **(o)One who came by water and blood..." The NASB has changed from "one" to "One" and I agree with their last copyright here. What do you find distasteful about studying capitalization? From the heart, Ray |
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7 | The Spirit or spirit?The Truth or truth? | 1 John 5:6 | Searcher56 | 122674 | ||
If it refers to anyone of the Trinity, or is a priper name - capitialize in English. | ||||||
8 | A witness of the (w)Word? Yes. Both? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 122792 | ||
Hi Searcher56, So if (i)It refers to anyone of the Trinity, capitalize in English. Our choice is whether the Spirit is the It or the One who gives life. My interpretation is that "The Spirit is the One who gives life; the flesh profits nothing;..." John 6:63 1 John 5:7, "And (i)It is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is the truth." My interpretation is "And the Spirit is the One who bears witness; because the Spirit is the truth." From the heart, Ray |
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9 | A witness of the (w)Word? Yes. Both? | 1 John 5:6 | Searcher56 | 122825 | ||
ray, This is the last time I will discuss the capitalization issue with you. The Trinity, Father, Son and Holy Spirit are not an "it" ... they are He. The "it" in 1 John 5:7 is not a pronoun | ||||||
10 | A witness of the (w)Word? Yes. Both? | 1 John 5:6 | Ray | 122829 | ||
Hi Searcher, O.K., I hear you. However, I would gladly try to be a ray of light if you would continue to be a searcher of truth. Best wishes, ray P.S. I am also a "counter of pronouns". Perhaps we can have some discussions concerning that other obsession of mine. I am considering Psalm 82 right now. From the heart, Ray |
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