Results 1 - 2 of 2
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Were Eve's desires sinful? | Gen 3:6 | Lionstrong | 92786 | ||
Thanks for your thoughts and questions, Aixon. What does it mean to be tempted? Whatever it means to be tempted it does not necessarily mean sin. Jesus, a true man, was truly tempted to sin, but his experience of being in the state of being tempted was not sin on his part. If being tempted is sin, then Christ sinned. We know this is not so. Therefore being tempted is not sin. Temptation occurs when we are "carried away and enticed" by our own lusts, says James. (James 1:12-15) While I do not like the sound of this especially when applied to Christ, James is talking about how sin comes forth. Jesus did not lust, but it is when lust has conceived that it gives birth to sin. I think this figurative language means that it is when we have said "yes" to our sinful desires that we have committed further sin. James deals specifically with lust, but the more general truth is that to be tempted is to desire something that the fulfilling of which will RESULT in sin. There is a difference between desire and lust that I will mention later. And let us also be very clear on what sin is. Sin is not "whatever is not of faith." Whatever is not of faith is sin, yes. (Rom. 4:23) But it is not the definition of sin. That which proceeds from unbelief is a violation of one of God's commands. It is a particular sin. Murder is sin, but like "whatever is not of faith," murder is not a definition of, but a particular instance of sin. Now one can define sin by listing all the commands of God that can be broken. Not believing God is sin; making idols for worship is sin, having another God, not keeping the Sabbath, not honoring your folks, etc. But a good definition is that sin is any lack of conformity to or transgression of the law of God. Now to Eve, when did she cross the sin line? My contention is that it was not crossed when she was tempted or when she desired the wisdom, nourishment or beauty of the fruit. The proof if this is in the transgression God charged them to be guilty of. "And He said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree of which I commanded you not to eat? ...Then to Adam He said, "Because you have listened to the voice of your wife, and have eaten from the tree about which I commanded you, saying, 'You shall not eat from it'; Cursed..." etc. (Gen. 3:11, 17.) Adam was charged with transgressing the express command concerning the forbidden fruit. He was not charged for having desires that the fruit could fulfill. Eve sinned when she sinned, that is, she sinned when she transgressed the express law of God forbidding her not to partake of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The prohibition to not touch the fruit was not God's command, nor did He sight it as a violation when he charged them. I think the prohibition was a precaution issued by Adam her lord (I Pet. 3:6) and husband and head of the human race. My contention is that beauty, wisdom and nourishment are legitimate desires, and God did not forbid these desires. There are sinful desires. God says do not commit adultery, and a person may desire to do so. When a desire is sinful it is called lust by which we are carried away and enticed. But in the case of Eve, what was her desire? Was it to eat the forbidden fruit or to gain wisdom? Was eating the fruit her aim, her purpose, her desire, or was it a means to an end? Her desire was wisdom, and Satan tricked her into fulfilling her legitimate desires by an illegitimate means. You pointed out yourself that God wants us to want wisdom and acquire it. But I differ with you on the issue of wanting to be as wise as God is. Was it wrong to want to be like God knowing good and evil? First of all, they were already like God. God created man in his own image. Yes, before the fall their "eyes were not yet opened," but nonetheless they were already the image and likeness of God. (Gen. 1:26,27) And who is to say that it was not God's purpose to eventually open man's eyes and give him the knowledge of good and evil? After all the sign of a mature Christian is his ability to discern between good and evil. In Hebrews 5:14 we read, "But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil." Add to this the Father's purpose to conform us to the image of Christ. (Rom. 8:29) "We are to grow up IN ALL ASPECTS into Him who is the head, even Christ," writes Paul. (Eph 4:15) (My caps) Christ himself is the wisdom of God and in him "are hidden ALL the treasures of wisdom and knowledge." (Col. 2:3)(My caps) Further, Paul affirms that we have the mind of Christ. (1 Cor 2:16) So to say that it is wrong to desire to be as wise as God is when He himself seems intent on making us so seems to be incorrect if not counterproductive. |
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2 | Were Eve's desires sinful? | Gen 3:6 | charley | 92801 | ||
I hope you do not mind, but here is how I perceive some of the questions put forth. Whatever is not of faith is sin. Faith is trusting God at His Word. Whatsoever is not of faith is doing what we want(our desires--name them one by one), and sin. Faith requires obedience to God or we can choose our flesh desires. I think James 1:13-15 gives us the anatonomy of sin clearly. 1.No man is tempted of God to sin against God. verse 13. v14--makes it clear sin comes from our own lusts or desires v14--also makes it clear that we are drawn away v15--then conceived sin James uses a sexual nature to describe the process of sin. First we have a desire for a woman or sin. Secondly, drawn away. In Greek this word has the same meaning as luring away as in fishing. So Satan is making sure our flesh desires are seeing some action/enticing to encourage us to partake. v15--When we say "I Do" CONCEPTION has taken place and sin. Now Genesis 3:6 states that she saw the tree as good for food, pleasant to the eyes, a tree desired to make one wise. That was her desire to partake of the tree. Now Satan lured her to fullfill her desire as all sins happen. Disobient to God and not by faith in obedience. Faith requires reliance on God and without that we are doing it according to self and desires. Now in the last paragraph you stated some passages for a case to know good and evil. In the NT gospels it is recorded many times. That Jesus said, I do what my Father commandeth. Faith. Also, Jesus was the second Adam. Body, Soul, Spirit of God. Did Jesus know good and Evil? I do not think so. After all he was the same as the first Adam before Sin. And did what the Father commandeth. Of course the Spirit of God left Adam in Sin and left a dead Spirit. So now with the Holy Spirit, at salvation, in us which is the mind of Christ or God and to attain back to where we are to be before Adam's Fall. This is not to know good and evil. We already know sin and dead to it. This is regeneration to give us the ability to start to attain Adam's pre-sin condition. Sanctification. But will not be complete "till we see Him, we will be like Him". Glorification Like Jesus faithful to the Father and perfect. Now to the statement you mentioned how this sounds with Jesus and lust. Jesus was body, soul and spirit of God. And Jesus did what the spirit of God commanded. So lust was not involved. He did not feed his lusts or desires. As we do with TV, advertisements, talk, thoughtsand etc. which only creates more desire or lust. Till? He listened only to the Father. Tempted of Satan, Yes. Tempted in all things as we, yes. But did what the Father told Him to do. Just a different perspective charley |
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