Results 1 - 4 of 4
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Adam and Eve, no fall from grace? | Gen 2:16 | Emmaus | 31725 | ||
Ambiguous grace. Whatever happened to simple "unmerited favor"? Suddenly we have to qualify for it by sinning. Now there is some strange "works rightousness." Emmaus |
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2 | Adam and Eve, no fall from grace? | Gen 2:16 | Lionstrong | 31796 | ||
Hi Emmaus, Did you check out my references? Qualify for grace: Mark 2:17 And hearing this, Jesus *said to them, "It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick; I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners." (Adam and Eve did not need grace, did not "qualify.") Rom 11:32 For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all. (Now we all need grace. Prior to God's shutting up all in disobedience, mercy/grace was not needed.) John 9:41 Jesus said to them, "If you were blind, you would have no sin; but since you say, 'We see,' your sin remains. (Also Mark 2:17. By God's grace we see our need of grace. We are blind and sick.) Luke 19:10 "For the Son of Man has come to seek and to save that which was lost." 1 Tim 1:15 It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all. (Christ does not save the un-lost righteous.) Peace, Lionstrong |
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3 | Adam and Eve, no fall from grace? | Gen 2:16 | Emmaus | 31857 | ||
Lionstrong, You miss my point entirely. It is this. Adam and Eve were created by God in a state of grace or justice before God. They lost that grace or justice through their sin and the fall. Jesus' saving grace is a restoration of that same grace that makes us just before God. It is called by some sanctifying grace, the grace that makes us holy and able to be in God's presence. It is the grace that is the very life of God in us. If Adam and Eve had that grace and lost it through free will, how can we say that we can not loose it in the same manner by a free will rejection just as they did? Unless Jesus has destroyed our free will in the restoration of grace. I still say your version is tanatmount to saying we have to sin in order to merit sanctifying grace and so is a wierd type of works righteousness. Adam and Eve did not merit the original sanctifying grace and neither do we the same sanctifying grace that is restored to us by Jesus and by which we are justified and saved. I guess we are just talking past each other here. I think I will let the matter rest, having made my point as clearly as I can. Emmaus |
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4 | Adam and Eve, no fall from grace? | Gen 2:16 | Lionstrong | 32348 | ||
Our First parents, Emmaus were created holy. They were not created "in a state of grace." Holy is what they were, not something given to them after they were created. Again, they were not given holiness by unmeritted favor; they were made in the image of God and therefore were holy being created as such. We are made holy by the grace of God, AFTER we lost that holiness through Adam's fall. I understand your point, Emmaus. As Protestants, we don't apply that expression to our pre-fall parents. Peace, Lionstrong |
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