Results 1 - 5 of 5
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Jesus experienced every kind of trial? | Heb 4:15 | Morant61 | 68586 | ||
Greetings Ray! Sorry, I was quoting from the NIV! So, I can take neither the credit nor the blame. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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2 | Jesus experienced every kind of trial? | Heb 4:15 | Ray | 68826 | ||
Hi Tim Moran, Since you chose the NIV to quote from, may I deduce that capitalization of pronouns denoting Deity is not a top priority for you? I spoke with a pastor friend the other day who studies from the NIV and he assured me that it was my problem if I felt they had to be capitalized. He did not need to have them capitalized to think of them as Deity. But my question is, how important is it to think of Jesus as "one who" knows what we go through here on earth because he came as a man? I know that He came here in the likeness of men and can now sympathize because He was tempted just as we are. But "sympathize with our weakness" is different from "empathize" as I was going to incorrectly type in as the translation just now. He came in the likeness of men but he did not come as a man in order that he could empathize. I believe that it is more important to know Jesus as "the One who" rather than consider him as "the one who". But even if you want to think of Him as both the One and the one, in this verse under consideration we must think of Him as the High Priest to my mind. I took note today that in the King James and the NKJ there is no pronoun for One or one. And the NKJ which capitalizes pronouns of Deity capitalizes High Priest. From the heart, Ray |
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3 | Jesus experienced every kind of trial? | Heb 4:15 | Morant61 | 68841 | ||
Greetings Ray! My basic position is that since neither Hebrew nor Greek used capitalization for deity that it really is not that big of an issue for me. However, I do personally try to captialize all references to God or Christ, even though the current English standard is not to do so! As far as the 'one who' or 'One Who' issue goes, it doesn't really make any difference in my understanding of the passage. I understand that Christ is God incarnate, so I always think of Him as 'He', not 'he' anyway! :-) Concerning the various translations, strictly speaking, 'one who' is not in the Greek text. The verse literally reads: "For we do not have a High Priest not able to sympathize with our weakness, but has been tempted according to all according to like manner without sin." It is clear though that the perfect participle 'has been tempted' refers to our 'High Priest'. Therefore, it makes more sense in English to say "He who" or "One who". As far as the NIV goes, I started using it simply because it was in modern English and easier for others to understand. I grew up with the KJV, and can read Greek, and struggle through Hebrew, so I usually do my study in the originals more than in the translations. But, for preaching and public reading, I just prefer to use the NIV - not that it is the best translation or anything, but simply because it is very readable. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | Jesus experienced every kind of trial? | Heb 4:15 | Ray | 68852 | ||
Hi Tim Moran, Thanks again for sharing your Greek knowlege with us. May I deduce from your literal translation (whether yours or your choice) that you agree with High Priest for Hebrews 4:15? I agree with that; so we actually would agree with the Amplified over against the NASB printed above. The NASB rendering above agrees with the literal translation offered in Jay P. Green, Sr.'s Interlinear. He shows the implied "one who" that you have mentioned by the use of parenthesis. Green's Interlinear, Hebrews 4:15, "For we do not have a high priest [sic] not being able to sympathize with our weaknesses, but (One) having been tried in all respects according to (our) likeness, apart from sin." Is there any way that we can agree with Green and the NASB here? Could the verse be showing a contrast between a high priest and the One who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, verse 14? I don't think I can; for I think that the writer is holding fast the confession of the High Priest being the Son of God and adding that we have a High Priest who can sympathize with our weaknesses. This High Priest is not like every other high priest taken from among men. Every other high priest "can deal gently with the ignorant and misguided, since he himself is beset with weakness." The high priest, being a man, can empathize. The High Priest, being a Man, can sympathize with their weakness, being able to come to the aid of those who are tempted. Jesus came in the likeness of men but He was the Son of God, the High Priest. Hebrews 2:17, "Therefore, He had to be like [but only in the likeness of men, as I have said] His brethren in all things, that He might become a merciful and faithful High Priest [see NKJ] in things pertaining to (God), to make propitiation for the sins of the people." Parenthesis mine for comparisons below. 1 John 2:2, "and He (Himself) is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world." Hebrews 2:9, "...that by the grace of God (He) might taste death for everyone." I loved studying Hebrews through the years, but it was difficult in many things about this Priest according to the order of Melchizadec. I better stop and ask you if I've made any sense to you. From the heart, Ray |
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5 | Jesus experienced every kind of trial? | Heb 4:15 | Morant61 | 68895 | ||
Greetings Ray! I think so! :-) I understand you to be asking if I agree that Heb. 4:15 must be speaking of Christ, and not a contrast between Christ and some high priest! (By the way, I would translate it as "High Priest"). I would agree that Heb. 4:15 must be speaking of Christ and not contrasting Christ and some other high prienst. My reason is simple. Heb. 4:14 clearly identifies this High Priest as Christ, and nothing in v. 15 indicates any change of subject. Well, I have to run! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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