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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | What do you think? | Luke 23:34 | Searcher56 | 17209 | ||
Bill Mc, I believe Jesus stopped being God on the cross, because He became sin for us (2Cor 5:21). God is perfect - without sin (Matt 5:48). Jesus was sinless (1Jhn 3:4-5). Also, God is immortal (1Tim 1:17). Up to that point He was God and could forgive sins, without asking the Father. He did know He was the perfect sacrifice for all sins for all time. Remember, Stephen also forgave those who were killing him (Acts 7:60). Steve |
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2 | Steve, Christ bore sins in His body. | Luke 23:34 | Bill Mc | 17242 | ||
Dear Steve, please read all of this post and judge for yourself if what I write has merit and stands up to scripture. Please reply and let me know what you think. I do agree that, on the surface, it appears that there would be a big problem with Jesus (being God) bearing sin and dying. This is because, as you have said, God is perfect - without sin and He is immortal. But we do know that Jesus was fully God and fully man. Here is what I believe: 1. Man is, similar to God, a tri-part being. We have a spirit, a soul, and a body -1 Thess 5:23 - 'Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.' Your true identity, who you are at the deepest level, is your spirit. Your soul is your mind, will, and emotions (personality) and your body houses your spirit and soul. You are a spirit who has a soul who lives in a body. We are not human beings with spiritual experiences. We are spiritual beings with human experiences. 2. Jesus, being fully man, had a spirit, soul, and body. References for His human spirit - Matt 27:50; Luke 23:46; John 19:30. References for His human soul - Matt 26:38; Mark 14:34; John 12:27. I won't list references for His physical body. Most people accept that (unless they are Gnostics). 3. This verse is KEY to understanding how Christ bore our sins: 1 Pet 2:24 'and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed.' He bore our sins in His BODY, not in His spirit or soul. Under the OT sacrifices, the animal being offered bore the sins in it's body (Animals don't have spirits but they do have souls). This is where, as you have stated, 2 Cor 5:21 says that He became sins for us. Want further proof? Heb 10:5,10 - 'Therefore, when He (Christ) comes into the world (incarnation), He says...a BODY You (God) have prepared for Me...By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the BODY of Jesus Christ once for all.' Christ bore our sins in His BODY, but His spirit, who He really was, and soul, His personality, DID NOT become sin. 4. Therefore, I don't believe that He stopped being God just because He bore our sins in His body. Paul says almost the same thing of the Christian in Rom chapter 7. There is a power of sin in the members of his body (vs.18,23), but it is not him, who he is (vs. 17,20,21). 5. Christ chose when to give up His human Spirit and, when He did, He died - Matt 27:50; Luke 23:46; John 19:30. 6. At the resurecction, Christ became a life-giving Spirit - 1 Cor 15:45 'So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.' Why? Because He came to give His physical life to bear our sins. And He now gives us His eternal spiritual life through the impartation of the Holy Spirit. Life begets life. Of course, He has His resurrected body now, too. Well, there's my take. I don't feel that it is necessary to strip Christ of His deity in order to have Him bear our sins in His body. What do you think, brother? In Him, Bill Mc |
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3 | Steve, Christ bore sins in His body. | Luke 23:34 | Searcher56 | 17262 | ||
Bill Mc, I understand your side. This has been debated by people with more study time than either of us. So let us leave it alone. Steve | ||||||
4 | Steve, Christ bore sins in His body. | Luke 23:34 | Bill Mc | 17290 | ||
Steve, I'm glad that you understand my side. However, I'm disappointed that you take the attitude of 'this has been debated by people with more study time than either of us. So let us leave it alone.' You're saying, 'My mind is made up, don't confuse me with scripture.' That is obviously your choice. Christianity has been debated for 2000 years and that is more time than either of us have. However, the Holy Spirit, through revelation of the scripture, is who enlightens us, not the amount of study time. You demonstrate much ignorance when your answer to a question is a flippant, 'Read your Bible.' The Pharisees knew their 'Bible' inside and out and Jesus called them sons of hell. Knowing scripture will not save you. Knowing the God of scripture does. The Holy Spirit ALONE knows the mind of God and He will reveal many things as we seek to understand the 'things that we are freely given in Christ.' I do respect your opinion and your right to have it. But your unwillingness to submit it to the truth of scripture demonstrates an unteachable spirit. I do not respect the answers that you have given me such as 'leave it alone, read your Bible, I'm done with you.' If that is your opinion, brother, then please follow your own statement and do not respond to my questions. I hold nothing against you but it is not edifying to anyone to give short, curt answers on this forum. Many people on this forum have challenged my beliefs and my understanding of scripture with a Christ-like attitude, in meekness and love. You would do well to learn from them. In Christ, Bill Mc |
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