Results 1 - 3 of 3
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Paul had problems? No one acts good? | Matt 11:28 | atdcross | 164730 | ||
Romans 7 is, I believe, not descriptive of any personal experience before or after conversion. 1 John 1:8-10 is not intended as descriptive of anyone's personal problems in relation to sin. These verses seem to combat some heretical teachings at the time related to claims of being sinless or absolute perfection. Regarding your surprise at my suggestion, after stating there are no inherent contradictions in the Bible, you claim, “the verses you quote refer to man's idea of what is good.” The verses I quoted were the words of Jesus (Matt 7:11; Luke 11:13), therefore, making the implication that Jesus statements here are merely “man’s idea.” I assumed you did not realize it and I only sought clarity in your position. Luke 11:13 stress the point of my argument. Jesus is affirming that even evil people can do a good deed. In general we may not disagree, however, specifically I disagree that the interpretation of Romans 7 is descriptive of the apostle’s personal experience. (1) To the question, “No one acts good”? the answer is that evil people to commit acts that are in and of themselves morally good. (2) To the question, “Paul had problems?” (in relation to Romans 7), the answer is that the apostle claimed to have led a blameless life before and after conversion (Phil 3:4-6; Acts 24:16). The apostle had no such struggle with sin as described in Romans 7:14 or 8:8. "Paul's experience as a Christian is the last thing that could be considered as the topic here. 'I am carnal, sold under sin'...To refer these words to Paul's status as a Christian, or to the status of any other Christian, is to torture the word of God...Paul had just finished saying that Christians are 'dead to sin' and 'alive unto God' in Christ Jesus (Romans 6:11); and to apply these words to Christians is to contradict what had just been stated" (Coffman). |
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2 | Paul had problems? No one acts good? | Matt 11:28 | DocTrinsograce | 164735 | ||
Dear Atdcross... You wrote, "Romans 7 is, I believe, not descriptive of any personal experience before or after conversion." A thought that you have expressed more than once in this forum and more than once elsewhere. I was going to demonstrate the deficiencies behind this statement. When, on further consider, question in due course surfaced in my mind, "Of whom, then is the experiences of chapter 7 being written?" You write, "Paul's experience as a Christian is the last thing that could be considered as the topic here." Continuing to leave an incredible vacuum that demands filling. When one comes to a passage of scripture, ejecting orthodox interpretation by the truck loads, it is remiss, at best, to fail to offer an alternative explanation. Certainly those 2,000 years of accumulated understanding, forming the basis for whole movements in the church, and the establishment of sound doctrine upon which creed, hymn, and sermon were written, warrant an interpretation at least as perspicuous as that which you jettison. Also, I'd be negligent if I didn't mention to you that coming into a public forum like this -- a lone crusader -- necessarily makes some well founded assumptions about your readers: They deserve an opportunity to way this theory of yours to see if it is found wanting. While you are at it, perhaps you might populate your personal profile so that we might be able to acknowledge the authority of the one making these new assertions. We'd like to see how you measure up to Augustine, Luther, Calvin, Beza, Wesly, Gill, Barnes, and others. (They are the old dead Bible students whose interpretation with which you have dispensed.) Please... elucidate! In Him, Doc |
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3 | Paul had problems? No one acts good? | Matt 11:28 | BradK | 164736 | ||
Hi Doc, Just a quick observation as I had similar thoughts. I think a very telling and important fact is in the grammar. In verses 7-13, the verb tenses are all past tense. In verses 14-25 the verbs are all present tense! So, in light of that, why would Paul distinguish tenses if he were not refering to himself as well as the clear fact that text uses "I"! Does I in grammar refer to someone other than the one writing? As usual, I believe the burden of proof is on the one making the assertion to prove it true! Speaking the Truth in Love, BradK |
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