Results 21 - 40 of 72
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: McGracer Ordered by Date |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
21 | Are the declared righteous righteous? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54239 | ||
Joe, So then, although the judge has declared you not guilty, then you still are? And though the judge gave you someone else's righteousness, you are still unrighteous before the judge? ---------- Rom 4:5, let's talk about credited first. What does credited mean? In other words, if I credit your bank account with 1000 dollars, is that now your 1000 dollars to spend or is it still my 1000 dollars? McGracer |
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22 | Can we lose our righteousness? | Not Specified | McGracer | 54236 | ||
Dear Forum, If God justifies us "declares us righteous" as a gift, then are we, for all practical purposes, always righteous before Him or can we lose our justification? McGracer |
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23 | Can we lose our righteousness? | Rom 8:34 | McGracer | 54242 | ||
Dear Forum, If God justifies us "declares us righteous" as a gift, then are we, for all practical purposes, always righteous before Him or can we lose our justification? McGracer |
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24 | Can we lose our righteousness? | Heb 10:14 | McGracer | 54246 | ||
Dear Forum, If God justifies us "declares us righteous" as a gift, then are we, for all practical purposes, always righteous before Him or can we lose our justification? McGracer |
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25 | Are the declared righteous righteous? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54226 | ||
If a judge declares you to be righteous, and gives you someone else's righteousness as your own, are you righteous from that point on? McGracer |
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26 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54222 | ||
Joe, I guess the difference comes down to our views of justification and sanctification. You seem to believe that God has declared you righteous (though you, as a person - your identity - are not so) and that you are now becoming more so through the process of sanctification. So you seem to feel that justification opens the door for God to now sanctify you and gradually make you, as a person, more righteous. I believe that God has already made me, through my union with Him, a righteous person. My new nature is a righteous one. I don't view justification as simply God pretending that I as righteous so that He can make me more righteous. I view Him declaring me righteous because He has made me, as a person, already righteous. My sanctification is a process whereby God manifest through my thoughts and actions what is already true of me as a person. I am not changing my thoughts and actions to become something that I am not. My thoughts (renewing my mind to the true of His Word) and my actions (submitting myself as a living sacrifice and allowing God to live through me) are a RESULT of what He has ALREADY done at the deepest part of me. I am not being sanctified to attain that which I do not already have. I am being sanctified outwardly BECAUSE, at the core of who I am, Christ is there and has ALREADY sanctified me inwardly. Thanks for your interaction, Joe. It's obvious that we agree as to the end result, that Christ be glorified in us and that we be made righteous, sanctified, and holy. The difference is that you feel this will be gradually accomplished down here and consumated at the death of your body. I believe that it is already finished in God's realm (heaven), that I get to experience that down here, and that my righteousness, sanctification, and holiness were consumated at the cross and resurrection of His body, not my own. Grace and peace to you, bro. May you grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord. McGracer |
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27 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54209 | ||
Joe, I agree, the OT saints were credited righteousness because Christ's sacrifice had not yet been completed. But you didn't answer my question. Where does the NT say that the NT believer is DECLARED righteous? I agree that OT saints were CREDITED righteousness because the payment for sin had not yet been fully made. But it was at the cross, what it not? So the NT believer is MADE righteous - Rom 5:17,19; Rom 8;10; 2 Cor 5:21; Eph 4:24; Phil 3:9. None of these verses mention DECLARE, do they? Where does the NT say that we, who are indwelt by the living Jesus Christ are DECLARED anything? You wrote: "This is why classical Protestantism holds to a doctrine of "imputed" righteousness rather than the Roman Catholic doctrine of "infused" or "inherent" righteousness. While Protestants hold that we are regenerated (born again with a new nature), there is no passage in the New Testament that insists that we are already righteous in our own right, meaning that now apart from Christ we are able to stand before the infinitely holy God of the universe on our own." Joe, you misunderstand what I am saying. I have never said that we are righteous solely in our own right or apart from Christ. NEVER! Quite to the contrary, I am saying that we are righteous BECAUSE of our union with Him, not apart from Him. We are no longer apart from Him and, indeed, never can be. So I agree that I have NO righteousness of my own apart from His that has been given to me. But the fact remains that His righteousness is now mine, this is NT justification. God declares what is so. It is finished! You have stated that you believe that you have a new nature. Is that new nature righteous? 2 Pet 1:4 says that we are partakers of the divine nature. Again, is that nature righteous? If so, then isn't that part of you righteous? We need an intercessor because we still have an accusor, don't we? You wrote: "Not only are we credited with the perfect righteousness of Christ, but also Christ on the Cross was "credited" with every single last sin of His people." This is not what the Bible says, bro. 2 Cor 5:21 says "He MADE Him (not credited Him) who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him." MADE, Joe, not credited. I don't understand how it happened. But it is what God says and I believe it. I don't understand the Trinity but even though that particular word is NOT used in the Bible, I believe it. So if God says MADE, then, guess what? it is MADE. I believe that the apostle Peter gives us a clue to how God did this in 1 Peter 2:24: "and He Himself bore our sins in His BODY (not in His spirit or in his nature) on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed." Have we died to sin? Most assuredly. Do we live to righteousness? Most assuredly. Romans 6:2,7,11,17,18,22. 2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it? 7 for he who has died is freed from sin. 11 Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 17 But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you were committed, 18 and having been freed from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. 22 But now having been freed from sin and enslaved to God, you derive your benefit, resulting in sanctification, and the outcome, eternal life. You wrote: "If God already sees us as righteous on our own, such activities on Jesus' part become unnecessary." Again, Joe, you accuse me falsely. I never said that we are righteous on our own. We are righteous because we are joined to Him. Period. I cannot make it any clearer than that. We are righteous solely because of Christ and His finished work. Wouldn't you agree? Or are you seeking your righteousness apart from Him? McGracer |
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28 | Are you refering to the thief ? | Matt 10:1 | McGracer | 54131 | ||
Andes, Technically, everyone is now born under the New Covenant dispensation. This is the age of grace. They enter into the benefits of the New Covenant by faith in Christ. While the thief on the cross' experienced bridged both the close of one covenant and the start of another, I find it foolish to argue that his experience is the "yardstick" by which we judge our salvation. The New Covenant, according to Hebrews, primarily has to do with the forgiveness of sins. Of course it entails other aspects as well. What really matters is not what happened to the thief (for we don't know exactly) but, rather, what will you do with Jesus Christ? The rest of the New Testament reveals the fullness of the gospel and what it entails. God does not tell us everything He knows. But He does reveal what we need to know. I'm sure I haven't answered your question to your satisfaction but I think I just saw a question about who Cain married that really needs to be answered. :) McGracer |
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29 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54115 | ||
Joe, You wrote: "It does sound illogical. Doesn't it make more sense to say that we are in the process of becoming what God has declared us to be IN CHRIST?" Certainly it sounds illogical. It is illogical for me to be born dead in trespasses and sins. It is illogical that Christ would be punished for my sins. It is illogical that I, who deserve nothing but eternal separation from God get eternal life instead. Yet it is grace. This is not sarcasm, bro, but where do you see that we are DECLARED to be anything? Can you show me a verse in the NASB from the NT that says that God DECLARES us as anything? I understand the theological definition of justification to be "declared righteous in God's sight." The problem is that definition isn't found in the scripture is it, not as we interpret it anyway. What do I mean? When we say that God declares us as being righteous, we are saying that although we are truly righteous, God pretends to see us that way. This is a falsehood. Why? Because that would be like a judge having mercy on a criminal, saying to him, "I declare that you are righteous," and then releasing him. The criminal would not be righteous, he would simply be forgiven. Justice was not met in this case. The judge simply declared something that was not true. In our case, the judge (God) declares us righteous because we ARE righteous. Why? Because Christ was made sin on our behalf. When did this happen? At the cross. God does not DECLARE something that is not there. God first GIVES US the righteousness of Jesus Christ. There is an exchange. He took ALL of my sin. I get ALL of His righteousness. Now, at justification, when God declares me righteous, justice has been served. Christ took my death. I get His life. He took my sins. I have His righteousness. Therefore, God DECLARES me righteous because I am. For any just judge to declare a criminal righteous, that criminal must be either truly innocent or someone but bear the punishment. To insist that we are not the righteousness of Christ, insists that He did not take our sins. The problem with typical justification interpretation is that folks say, "God declared me righteous and now I am going to earn what I've been declared." This is backwards from the Christ-life. Grace living says, "God has made me righteous in spirit, I am going to live out what He has made me and let it become my experience. You wrote: "Did my comments on Paul saying you and I WERE justified in Romans 8 (written 1900 years ago) not make sense? I would like to hear your comments on why the Holy Spirit moved Paul to write that God justified us at a point when we hadn't been born yet." Because, as I have already said, in God's realm (not bound by time or space) things just ARE. Christ was slain from the foundation of the world. That's illogical, is it not? We are already seated with Christ in the heavenlies. That's quite illogical because I'm sitting here typing. So we have to decide whether we are going to believe in a God who may seem, from our viewpoint, illogical or whether we will just take Him at His Word. You may not agree with my viewpoint, but as long as you understand it, you can see why I say that many Christians are still wandering in the wilderness. The promised land is a place of rest. It is resting in Christ's finished work. God has already blessed us with EVERY spiritual blessing in the heavenly places (where we are also seated) in Christ. There is nothing more that we need except to believe it and learn to grow into what we already are. An apple does not become more of an apple as it matures. It simply grows into what it already is. McGracer |
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30 | Are you refering to the thief ? | Matt 10:1 | McGracer | 54114 | ||
Andes, I'm pressed for time also, so I'll reply to the first question and leave the rest for others. :) The New Covenant went into effect at the shedding of Christ's blood. Covenants require the shedding of blood to put them into effect. So the thief on the cross actually died AFTER the New Covenant went into effect. Jesus told him that He would be with him in Paradise that day and I'll leave all the rest for others to argue about. :) McGracer |
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31 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54106 | ||
Joe, You wrote: "The view you hold seems to be that everything that Christ's death has accomplished has already been given to us at the moment of salvation." Yes, Joe, that is the view I hold. 2 Pet 1:3 - Seeing that His divine power HAS GRANTED (past tense) to us EVERYTHING pertaining to life and godliness, through the true knowledge of Him who called us by His own glory and excellence. But, could I make a stippulation here? This is how I would define it: In my spirit, where I am joined to God - 1 Cor 6:17 (yet distinct from Him i.e. I am NOT God, I am just in union with Him), these attributes (sanctification, holiness, righteousness, perfection, completeness) are ALREADY true. How could that Lord join Himself to me otherwise? Is is nothing that I have done, it is all HIS doing. It is by His doing that I am in His blessed Son. In my spirit, which is eternal, because I am joined to Him, I am as He is - 1 John 4:17 - "By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world." So ARE WE, Joe, HERE in THIS WORLD, not the next. Yet, at the same time, I realize that my soul is very much in the process of being sanctified, being made holy, being perfected, being cleansed, being made righteous. This is not an incongruity, it is a reality. I am becoming what I already am. I know, it sounds ludicrous, but it is not. It is called faith. The Israelites faced the same struggle and doubt when they first got to the promised land. It was already theirs. God had given it to Abraham and because they were his seed, his land was their land. All the needed to do was to put, in faith, put action to what was already true. But they didn't do it. Instead, they relied on their eye-sight and their experiences instead of God and His Word to them. God said, "It is already yours." They said, "Impossible. We are not there yet and we can't get there from here." As a result, that generation perished in the wilderness simply because of unbelief. Many Christians live the same way. All God's promises for abundant life, for holiness, for righteousness, for union with Jesus are all for "someday" - if not here, then when we get home. They come to Christ for the salvation He offers and then they spend the rest of their lives struggling to become what, in Him, they already are. In God's economy of faith, we become in action and attitude because we already are in constitution. You probably don't agree with this. That's okay. I can convince no one. That is His job. All I can do is to share. The New Testament says many things about us that our experience does not bear out. It says that we are citizens of heaven (Phil 3:20), that we have been washed, sanctified, justified (all past tense) (1 Cor 6:11). It says that we have already been made complete (Col 2:10). It says that we are already holy (Rom 11:6; Eph 4:24; Col 3:12; Heb 3:1; 1 Pet 2:9). It even says that we have been perfected for ALL time (Heb 10:14). It says that we are ALREADY seated with Him in the heavenlies (Eph 2:6). As long as we approach these truths from a fleshly view-point, we will remain, as the Israelites were, in unbelief and not enter His rest. We will be forever striving to become what He has already done in us in the spirit, eternal realm. I pray that you, brother, will enter the Sabbath-rest that remains for the people of God. The Sabbath-rest is not for "sinners". It is for saints who have grown tired of their own works and are fully trusting in His. Unless we learn to discern the difference between the spiritual realm that is not bound by time and the soul/body realm that is temporarily bound here, we will never "arrive." I become in experience what I already am. Experience said that the withered hand was permanent. God's realm proved that it was temporary. Experience said that Lazarus was permanently dead, resurrection was "someday". Jesus said, "Resurrection is today!" Experience said that Christ was permanently dead. The Spirit raised Him and said, "Not so." Don't be too quick to believe your eyes. We look not at the things that are seen, for the things that are seen are temporal (time-based). We look at the things that are NOT seen, for the things that are NOT seen (of God's spiritual realm) are ETERNAL (no beginning and no end). Spiritual things simply ARE because of the great I AM. May you grown in who you already are, brother Joe. McGracer |
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32 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54084 | ||
Joe, Thanks for your well-thought out response. You may indeed be right. If I were to look at my experience and performance alone, I would have to conclude that I am not perfect because I still sin. If I were to look at the my condition alone, I would have to conclude that I am not yet glorified. And yet, if I were to look at my performance and experience, I wouldn't always conclude that I am justified, a new creation, born again, clothed with Christ, complete in Him, forgiven, holy, or even saved! So, to me, the question becomes, is my identity in Christ determined by what He did or by what I do (or what will happen to my body)? As you well know, there are many scriptures that speak of our sanctification in the past tense. There are also many that speak of it in the future tense. It is the same way with holiness. We are called holy. We are also told to be holy. I've found that most of the time, God's Word is quite clear and speaks for itself. If God says that I am already "perfected for all time", then I have a choice to believe it or to say that He doesn't mean what He says. If He says that I have already been glorified - Rom 8:30 - then I have the same choice. I must either look to my experience as the standard of truth or look to what He says. I may be naive, but I firmly believe that if God meant that our "perfection" was only future, He would have said so. Heb 10:14 would say, "For by one offering He WILL PERFECT WHEN WE DIE those whose are WILL THEN BE sanctified." I respectfully submit to you, brother, that this is NOT what it says. Nor does Heb 10:10 say, "By this will we WILL BE, WHEN WE DIE, SANCTIFIED through the DEATH OF YOUR BODY AT THAT TIME." I believe that these spiritual truths are NOT tied to the death of your body, but to the death and resurrection of HIS. It is our new birth in Christ that determines what we are, not our death. I'll close with this thought. I assume you believe that all men are born sinners, right? When are they made sinners? When they first sin? Is it their actions that make them sinners or is it their nature that makes them sin? I would contend that they sin BECAUSE they are ALREADY sinners. So when did you become everything that you are "in Adam"? When you are physically born. When do you become, in identity, everything that you are in Christ? Likewise, when you are born "again." Those who are in Adam do not become sinners when they die. Death does not determine identity. Birth does. Likewise, you do not become, in identity, holy, perfected, sanctified, righteous, when you die. The death of your body has NOTHING whatsoever to do with your spiritual condition OTHER THAN sealing it. Whatever spiritual condition you are in when you die - in Adam or in Christ - is what you will remain. As I said, Joe. You may be right. But I'm convinced that it is my new birth, not my eventual death, that determines who I am. It is Christ in me that imparts these wonderful characteristics that, as Peter says, allows me to here and now have everything I need for life and godliness. "We look at the things that are unseen for they are ETERNAL. The things that are seen are TEMPORAL." Where will you look for your identity, Joe? Will you look at the death of your body, a mere tent that houses the real you, for who you are in Christ? Or will you look back to the work of Christ and His resurrection for your spiritual identity. None of these things come from ourselves. They all come from our union with Him. He is the true Vine and source. We are merely the branches. As Paul writes in Rom 11:16 - "If the root (Christ) is holy, the branches ARE (not WILL BE) too." I will not call God a liar by insisting that He doesn't know what He said or that the writers of the NT had no concept of verb tenses. If He says it, that's good enough for my simple mind and faith. Thanks for the interaction. McGracer |
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33 | What is perfected for all time? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54074 | ||
Joe, What would you say that Heb 10:14 means then? It says that Christ's offering has perfected us for all time (those of us who are being sanctified). If we have not been made perfect yet, then why does the writer say that we have been (past tense) for ALL time? Thanks for your input. McGracer |
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34 | Once saved, aways saved doctrine refuted | Matt 10:1 | McGracer | 54072 | ||
Grace and Truth, Yes and no. I can go live anyway I want to. BUT He changes my WANT TO. I now what Christ to be my life - Col 3:4. I want to learn to say with Paul, "I no longer live, but Christ lives in me." I want to learn to grow in the grace and knowledge of my Lord. I want to read my Bible and learn more of Him for who died for me (and now lives in me). I want to edify my brothers and sisters in Christ and yet speak the truth, for truth sets us free. I want to support my local church for God is using it in my community to reach others for Christ. I want to intercede in prayer on the behalf of others and lead them to come to know who they are in Christ. Christ does not save us and then walk away. He now indwells us through the Holy Spirit and leads and guides us. I am now learning to live the Christ-life. I am safe in Him forever and I'm ready to go out and have fun lifting up my Lord. Thanks for the dare! I'll take it! McGracer |
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35 | Once saved, aways saved doctrine refuted | Matt 10:1 | McGracer | 54063 | ||
Grace and Truth, Sorry, bro, these don't mix. Your salvation cannot be completely based on Christ's finished work AND your faithfulness. Your faithfulness is works, bro, and NO ONE is completely faithful EXCEPT God. Ya just can't have it both ways. It is Christ alone. McGracer |
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36 | Is baptism necessary for salvation? | Acts 10:48 | McGracer | 54060 | ||
Dear Grace and Truth, This assertion, brother is simply not true. Baptism is, first and foremost, a spiritual act. Consider 1 Corinthians 12:13 - For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. We are not baptized into Christ when we are dunked in water, brother. We are baptized spiritually into Christ as soon as we believe. The water is merely a physical form that represents the spiritual truth. This is the heart of Gal 3:27 and Rom 6:3-5. These passages do not mention water whatsoever. They are speaking of spiritual truth. Jesus well explains the meaning of John 3:3,5 in verse 6. That which is born of flesh is flesh - you are first born surrounded by a sack of water. At birth, the water breaks and then you are born. That is flesh birth. That which is born of Spirit is spirit. God caused us a new spirit to be born in us at new birth and He indwells that spirit. Jesus' words had nothing whatsoever to do with being dunked in water. Dear brother, do not mistake the picture for the reality. Water baptism is a physical picture of your very real union with Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection. As He physically died, you were spiritually dead. As He was physically buried, you were spiritually buried. As He physically rose from the dead, you have been (past tense) spiritually raised from the dead to walk in the newness of life - Rom 6:4. This is spiritual truth and H2O cannot save you. Only Christ can save you. Being spiritually baptized by the Holy Spirit into Christ is what saves you, not getting your body wet. Please don't mistake the two. One represents the other, therefore one is lesser than the other. One is reality, one is a symbol. Please don't make them equal. McGracer |
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37 | What do the rest of you think? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54042 | ||
Tim, Yes, thanks for the clarification. I believe they were made during at their resurrection. They just didn't receive it during their lifetime whereas we do through new birth. Thanks, bro. I know what I want to say but I can't always find the words, or, if I do find them, I forget where I leave them. :) McGracer |
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38 | What do the rest of you think? | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54033 | ||
Joe, I'd like to hear some other opinions on this too so I'll also repost this as a question. While I'm not the "rest of you", I wanted to share this verse: Titus 3:4 - But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared, He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior. I see lots of instances in the OT of the Holy Spirit coming upon someone to enable them to do what God called them to do but I haven't really found any instances of someone being "born again" or of them actually posessing eternal life. This doesn't mean that they didn't live forever because everyone lives forever in one place or another. But Daniel 12:2 says that "Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt." Everlasting life, for OT believers starts at their resurrection. We are partakers, not of everlasting life (life which has a beginning but no end), but of ETERNAL life, Christ's life, which has NO beginning and NO end, for He is eternal. I believe that this is what the writer of Hebrews is saying in Heb 11:39 where he says that all the OT believers did not receive the eternal life that was promised them during their life-times. But, in verse 40, we have received something better than they, eternal life - here and now in Christ. In this aspect, the OT was never made perfect - see also Heb 10:1. We, in contrast, posess eternal life - Christ's life - and His completed sacrifice has made us, from God's viewpoint, perfect for ALL time - Heb 10:14. What do the rest of you think? Thanks, Joe. McGracer |
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39 | rock foundation | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54025 | ||
Append, BTW Joe, I am not implying that OT saints were not influenced by or aware of the Holy Spirit. They very much were. I am just saying that the Holy Spirit did not indwell the average OT believer through out his (or her) whole life. The Spirit left Saul. David was very much aware that God's Spirit would leave him because of his sin. As NT believers, we should not live in that fear. Our sins have been dealt with once-and-for-all. Therefore, God re-creates us as new creatures in Him and indwells us forever - 2 Cor 5:17; Gal 6:15; Eph 2:10; Eph 4:24. McGracer |
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40 | rock foundation | Matt 7:24 | McGracer | 54023 | ||
Joe, Job pleased God by his faith in Him - Heb 11:2,39 - For by it (faith) the men of old gained approval. OT saints placed their faith in God (and whatever His word was to them at the time) and their faith in God was credited to them as righteousness. Without faith, it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God. This is faith in Him and what He says, not faith in our efforts to keep the Law or "Christian principles." Job was ALREADY a believer in God when God said that he was blameless and upright. Because he was an OT believer, he feared God and turned away from evil. So it was Job's relationship with God, a faith relationship that allowed God to call him blameless and upright. We, as NT believers are called the same thing - Eph 1:4; Eph 5:27; Col 1:22. We are not holy and blameless because we don't sin. We are holy and blameless because we have placed our faith and turst in God and He now indwells us. McGracer |
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