Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | Makarios | 105999 | ||
Greetings Colin! Excellent question! According to the Strongest Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, the word translated as "mind" [KJV] in 1 Sam. 2:35 is the Hebrew word #5315 'nepes' or 'nephesh' (Greek equivalent: #5883) meaning "breath; by extension: life, life force, soul, an immaterial part of a person, the seat of emotion and desire; a creature or person as a whole: self, body, even corpse: [rendered as] soul [416 times], life [100], souls [58], lives [18], persons [13], heart [12], mind [11], creature [9]", and various other places in the KJV.. (1) All of the places in the KJV where 'nephesh' is translated as "mind" are: Gen. 23:8; Dt. 18:6; 28:65; 1 Sam. 2:35; 1 Chr. 28:9; Jer. 15:1; Ezek. 23:17,18-twice,22,28. Total - 11 times. As far as 'soul' and 'mind' being interchangeable, I would say that it is based more upon the interpretations of the translators than anything else, but this is a classic example as you have pointed out! The KJV, NKJV, ASV, RSV, ESV and Amplified all have "mind" in 1 Sam. 2:35, while the NASB has the more literal "soul" in place, perhaps due to consistency.. The translators of the KJV, NKJV, ASV, RSV, ESV and Amplified were clearly not as comfortable using "soul" in a place in Scripture that refers back to God. Does God have a "soul" like ours? That is why I believe that the KJV translators sought to put "mind" here instead of soul, since it refers back to God. However, I believe that the most accurate or literal rendering of 'nepes' in this verse is "soul" as the NASB has it. In the KJV, 'nepes' was rendered as "soul" 416 times, compared to only 11 times for rendering the same Hebrew word as "mind." Therefore, 'soul' would be the most literal translation of 'nepes' in 1 Sam. 2:35. Which do I think is the better choice? Extremely tough question, and putting me on the spot! :-) Let's take a step back and consider the REAL question here: Does God have a "soul" like ours? First of all, if God has a Soul in any way that would resemble our soul, then we can't think of His soul in the same way that we consider our individual souls, since God is a Triune God. You see, as God has three individual Persons, we also have a physical being, a mind and a soul. Jesus Christ, in His humanity, had a human soul and spirit (Matt. 26:38; Luke 23:46). But this does not include His Deity, in which I believe that His 'soul' can only be understood or described in terms of the Holy Spirit. God the Father is not known to us through Scripture as having a 'soul', even though we know His will. I believe that He Himself is beyond what we think of as having a 'soul', and His 'soul' can only be defined in terms of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit has a will (1 Cor. 12:11). But the Holy Spirit is also illustrated as clothing (Luke 24:49), fire (Acts 2:3), water (John 4:14; 7:38-39) and wind (John 3:8; Acts 2:1-2). Therefore, if the Holy Spirit Himself can fit the very description in regards to God as compared to what we call 'a soul' in human terms (breath; by extension: life, life force, soul, an immaterial part of a person, the seat of emotion and desire; a creature or person as a whole: self, body, even corpse), then we could say that the Holy Spirit could serve as the "soul" of God. Or, perhaps, our souls, in and of themselves, are small "copies" of the Holy Spirit. :-) But that is another discussion. To come full circle, we could conclude that in 1 Samuel 2:35, "God would raise up for Himself a faithful priest who would do according to what is in His heart and in His soul (i.e., the Holy Spirit).." And that is what my choice would be as far as the best way to "amplify" this verse! Blessings to you, Makarios |
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2 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | flinkywood | 106077 | ||
Makarios, a follow-up. This morning I thought that, in accord with your analysis, 1 Sam 2.35 might also read: "But I will raise up for Myself a faithful priest who will do according to what is in My heart and in My 'spirit'; and I will build him an enduring house, and he will walk before My anointed always." (NASB) Jarring, yes, but 'spirit' might be as close to OT understanding as we can get. Colin |
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3 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | Makarios | 106088 | ||
Greetings Colin! Let me beat Ray to the punch: Will that be 'spirit' (lowercase) or 'Spirit' (uppercase)? Just kidding, my friend! :-) But I would agree, even though the Holy Spirit (Hebrew: 'ruach') is not the word that is used in this verse (even though it is similar to 'nephesh'). The Holy Spirit is clearly defined in the Old Testament, giving life to creation (Ps. 104:30; Job 33:4), order to creation (Is. 40:12; Job 26:13), adornment to creation (Ps. 33:6; Job 26:13), and preservation to creation (Ps. 104:30). The Holy Spirit was in certain OT figures (Gen. 41:38; Num. 27:18; Dan. 4:8; 5:11-14; 6:3), came upon many (Judges 3:10; 6:34; 11:29; 13:25; 1 Sam. 10:9-10; 16:13), filled some (Ex. 31:3; 35:31). Therefore, we know that He (the Holy Spirit) was very active in the OT, even though His personal relationship to men at that time was not necessarily permanent (Ps. 51:11). Blessings to you, Makarios |
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4 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | flinkywood | 106093 | ||
Makarios, You’ve responded to an addendum on the reply I made you before this post. I don't understand "ruach" any more than I understand "soul" in the OT. I've seen a Rabbinic commentary that lists 5 components of soul, ruach among them, but separated by the intensity of its meaning. Here is something I dug up on "Soul" I'm posting this here in full: Read it and reap: "Hebrew - nephesh “Strong's - Hebrew 5315 (see Greek 5590) “KJV - appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, desire, ghost, he, heart, life, lust, man, me, mind, mortality, one, own, person, pleasure, self, them, your-selves, soul, they thing, will “NIV - life, lives, soul, (personal pronouns: I, we, you, he, she, they, myself, ourselves, yourself, yourselves, himself, herself, themselves), person, s, people, heart, man, someone, anyone, everyone, creatures, appetite, desire, s, spirit, body, creature, those “BDB (The Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew and English Lexicon, edited by Francis Brown, S.R.Driver, and Charles A. Briggs, Peabody, MA: Hendrickson Publishers, 1996, page 659-661) “Theological Lexicon of the Old Testament, Volume 2 (edited by Ernst Jenni and Claus Westermann, translated by Mark E. Biddle, Peabody, MA: Hendrickson, 1997, page 743-759, article by Claus Westermann). Near the beginning of this lengthy article, Dr. Westermann writes: The summary of the meanings and usages of nepes (abbreviated n.) in the OT are structured as follows: “1. Concrete meanings: (a) breath, (b) throat, gullet “2. Longing, desire, craving: (a) hunger, (b) vengeance, (c) desire, wish, choice, (d) negative aspects, (e) fixed expressions “3. Soul: (a) desirous, (b) hungry, sated, (c) melancholy, happy, (d) hoping, (e) loving, hating, (f) alive, (g) summary... “(g) If one surveys the categories in which "soul" translates n., one notes, first of all, a peculiar polar character of the usage of n. The soul thirsts, becomes sated; it desires, finds peace; it sorrows, rejoices; it love, hates, etc. In these categories n. exists only in such contrasts. An additional observation is that an intensive orientation toward something dominates this usage. It can have a more passive (thirst, famish, etc.) or more active sense (hate, abhor, etc.). The commonality is the intensity of the experience. Both observatiuons belong together and point to the characteristic element of n. "Soul." They indicate that this cataegory of usage closely resembles that in which n. denotes "desire, longing, yearning" (see 2), but that the Eng. translation "soul" is, in part, only a makeshift. Only in 3c-d do the usage of Eng. "soul" and Hebr. n. coincides to a degree. n. appears once alongside -- basar "body" (Isa 10:18 "he will destroy soul and body") as a merism in the sense of "entirety." “4. Life (a) deliverance, protection, maintenance, (b) threat, detriment, (c) summary... “(c) A review of passages in which n. means "life" (or in which it can be translated with the Eng. word "life") reveals a surprising circumstance: n. does not mean "life" in the general, very broad sense which modern European languages use it (life in terms of divergent forms of the phenomenon; cf. "big-city life," "course of life," etc.). Instead, usage is strictly confined to the limits of life; n. is life in contrast to death. Consequently, occurrences of n. in this meaning divide naturally into two major categories (see 4 a and b); one concerns deliverance or preservation, the other threat or destruction of life. “5. Living being, person (a) in laws, (b) in enumerations, (c) general expressions, (d) pronoun usage “It is oftgen a matter of judgment whether one should translate n. as "my soul" or as the pronoun "I" (e.g., see 3f; in the Psa. esp. semasiological and stylistic factors must be taken into account... “6. Corpse." Found at: http://www.bibletexts.com/sh/hg/h5315.htm God’s "soul" in 1 Sam 2.35 sounds like God's mind plus, and thus might be seen as a thinking-active force in the affairs of men. Oh, boy… Colin |
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5 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | Makarios | 106097 | ||
Greetings Colin! Good stuff! But that is just a bit too "broad" of a definition of 'soul' for my tastes, even though it confirms what I shared in my first post. Blessings to you, Makarios |
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6 | God's "Mind" or "Soul" in 1 Sam 2:25? | 1 Sam 2:35 | flinkywood | 106101 | ||
Makarios, I agree; it is too broad a definition. I found a rabbinical opinion that's even broader, positing 5 aspects of soul, including ruach, if you can stand it. The bible is such an imnpossible book. It drives me sane, sometimes. Colin. |
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