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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | how can we minister to homosexuals | Bible general Archive 4 | jlhetrick | 209193 | ||
Doc- sorry for the delay... BBQ night with the family...thanks for the response brother. Thanks for having patients with me also. For easier following I’ll include your quote of me. “"It's not our place to ever tell someone their going to Hell..." (sic)” Now I’ll quote the original question from Tyboswell: “how can we minister to homosexuals rather than tellin them they are going to hell or avoidin the issue i hop im clear” I was responding directly to Tyboswell’s “rather than telling them they are going to hell.” My point (and I’m sorry I’m having such a hard time articulating it) was/is that it is not our place as fallen creatures to judge another person’s eternal state. We couldn’t if we wanted to and we’re never taught in Scripture to do so. With that said, God’s grace to transform the unbeliever is not only in the question, it is the essential point, both in regard to his question and my response to him. We might look at it this way. If we know a person is already going to Hell, why would we witness to him/her in the first place? It’s possibly a reason why God does not give you and me the ability to know if another will be lost to eternal damnation or saved by God’s grace. As long as there is still breath and a conscious thought, there is the possibility of responding to the Savior; even if one’s sin has him nailed to a cross. The thief on the cross next to our Savior certainly fell into 1Corinthians 6:9-11. Of course... so did the Apostle Paul, so did I, so did you and the list goes on. As I have represented in this thread (at least I believed so) my response had nothing to do with not calling sin for what it is. It was specifically to say that we are not in a position to judge the eternal condition of another. I am quite in agreement with you that Scripture clearly teaches how a person’s behavior effects how he/she stands before God; Just as Scripture teaches that none of those behaviors are beyond the redemptive love and grace of our Holy God. As you pointed out from Matthew 7: "...the Scripture is unequivocal that we are to be careful observers, not only of our own lives (2 Corinthians 13:5), but also the lives of others (Hebrews 12:15-16)” Keep in mind that Hebrews 12:15-16 is talking to believers about believers. The context of the passage is that of describing, in part,the process of sanctification to include that part in which believers participate one to another. It has nothing whatever to do with witnessing to the unsaved nor does it speak to judging the final state of another’s sole. Doc, thanks for, as always, working patiently through the topic. Not that I’m calling it done, just don’t know that I can add more than I already have offered. God bless, Jeff |
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2 | how can we minister to homosexuals | Bible general Archive 4 | DocTrinsograce | 209237 | ||
Dear Jeff, You wrote, "...how a person’s behavior effects how he/she stands before God..." I don't think I said that -- if I did it was a mistake. Bishop Ryle stated it better than I might ever do: "When I speak of growth in grace, I do not for a moment mean that a believer's interest in Christ can grow. I do not mean that he can grow in safety, acceptance with God or security. I do not mean that he can ever be more justified, more pardoned, more forgiven, more at peace with God, than he is the first moment he believes. I hold firmly that the justification of a believer is a finished, perfect and complete work; and that the weakest saint, though he may not know and feel it, is as completely justified as the strongest. I hold firmly that our election, calling, and standing in Christ admit of no degrees, increase or diminution... I would go to the stake, God helping me, for the glorious truth, that in the matter of justification before God every believer is complete in Christ (Colossians 2:10)." We'd not say that a person's behavior effects their standing before God. Rather, a person's standing before God results in a specific kind of behavior. See Galatians 6:15. Think of it this way: The fruit does not effect the species of the tree. The species of the tree results in a specific kind of fruit. In addition, the old man is not stuck on a cross, yet still able to gasp for mercy. The old man must be crucified with Christ (Galatians 2:20) -- i.e., dead as a door nail! The man in Christ of 2 Corinthians 5:17 is not a reformed sinner, he is a new creation. In redemption, God kills the sinner and raises him to newness in life. In Him, Doc |
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3 | how can we minister to homosexuals | Bible general Archive 4 | jlhetrick | 209247 | ||
Dear Doc- Here is how you put it: "Scripture is quite clear about a number of specific behaviors and how they relate to how a person stands before our Holy God" I believe Bishop Ryle is talking about something different, but I agree with you... he makes plain sense. Justification is not an ongoing process. When we are justified, it is a final act of saving grace. However, how we might "stand before God" after that (being justified) would be, as I understand it, a matter of our being sanctified (Hebrews 10:14). The new creation continues in a process of being made holy. Even as new creations we are not perfect in our obedience and submission to God. Perfectly justified and saved, but not perfectly holy. This is what I assumed you were infering when you wrote "Scripture is quite clear about a number of specific behaviors and how they relate to how a person stands before our Holy God". If I took your words out of context and/or my paraphrase seemed to imply a different meaning than your intended one, then please accept my sincere apology. God bless, Jeff |
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4 | how can we minister to homosexuals | Bible general Archive 4 | DocTrinsograce | 209261 | ||
Hi, Brother Jeff... Yes, thank you, that was what I thought I had said. Specific behaviors disclose our standing before God. They do not cause it. No worries, really, Jeff. As doctrine is gifted us textually, our textual expressions either rightly reflect those truths or they reflect something else. We are all counselors, directly, indirectly, tacitly, and implicitly... whether we are aware of it or not. Satan started the bad counsel trend by twisting what God had said. Since then there has been nothing but an ever increasing bedlam of ever deviating advice telling us what to think and what to believe. Our careful and cooperative effort to render words in concert with our Lord's Word is a work of a good steward, demonstrating our love for Him and His Word. In Him, Doc |
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5 | how can we minister to homosexuals | Bible general Archive 4 | jlhetrick | 209296 | ||
Amen! | ||||||