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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | MARK 16:16: Was it perverted? | Bible general Archive 2 | GeorJoy | 101952 | ||
Jesus did say as you quoted, but it is also written, "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:" It did not say "to them that believe on his name and are baptized..." Baptism is a profession before "man" of ones faith. "A symbol." Not a necessity for salvation. The bible must be taken as a whole before one can glean the true wealth thereof. Not a bit here and a morsel there. This is the biggest downfall of the "so called Christian" today. IGNORANCE. If you listen close enough your "discernment" will tell you if these so called evangelists are false prophets or not, "for many will come in my name... but..." Your best defence to protect from a counterfeit is to know the original. And, I believe it has been said "the best offence is a good defence." So... How can one know the original? How can one defend their immortal soul? Simple.... Read and head 2Ti 2:15. In Christ George |
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2 | MARK 16:16: Was it perverted? | Bible general Archive 2 | punkiedo | 114010 | ||
George how do you explain 1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: ??? When we are baptized we are buried with Jesus. Romans 6:3 Without baptism that dead old man that died in REPENTANCE starts to stink. I like to think of it as a child who goes outside and gets covered in mud. He can wipe the mud off but he is not clean until he gets in the water. When we repent we should be ready to get that sin off of our life. And that is what baptism does. It washes away our sins. Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord. Baptism is immersion in water. Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? Where is the scripture that says that Baptism #1 does not save us. and #2 that it is a sign for man? BTW maybe you should heed your own advice about 1 Timothy 2:15 AND 16 It is very important to read verse 16 too. |
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3 | MARK 16:16: Was it perverted? | Bible general Archive 2 | BradK | 114011 | ||
punkiedo, I rather like what the late and eminent A.T. Robertson ( a noted Greek Scholar) says of 1 Peter 3:21: "Which also (o kai). Water just mentioned. After a true likeness (antitupon). Water in baptism now as an anti-type of Noah's deliverance by water. For baptisma see on "Mt 3:7". For antitupon see on "Heb 9:24" (only other N.T. example) where the word is used of the earthly tabernacle corresponding (antitupa) to the heavenly, which is the pattern (tupon Hebrews 8:5) for the earthly. So here baptism is presented as corresponding to (prefigured by) the deliverance of Noah's family by water. It is only a vague parallel, but not over-fanciful. Doth now save you (umaß nun swzei). Simplex verb (swzw, not the compound diaswzw). The saving by baptism which Peter here mentions is only symbolic (a metaphor or picture as in Romans 6:2-6), not actual as Peter hastens to explain. Not the putting away of the filth of the flesh (ou sarkoß apoqesiß rupou). Apoqesiß is old word from apotiqhmi (Romans 2:1), in N.T. only here and 2 Peter 1:14. Rupou (genitive of rupoß) is old word (cf. ruparoß, filthy, in James 2:2; Revelation 22:11), here only in N.T. (cf. Isaiah 3:3; Isaiah 4:4). Baptism, Peter explains, does not wash away the filth of the flesh either in a literal sense, as a bath for the body, or in a metaphorical sense of the filth of the soul. No ceremonies really affect the conscience (Hebrews 9:13). Peter here expressly denies baptismal remission of sin. But the interrogation of a good conscience toward God (alla suneidhsewß agaqhß eperwthma eiß qeon). Old word from eperwtaw (to question as in Mark 9:32; Matthew 16:1), here only in N.T. In ancient Greek it never means answer, but only inquiry. The inscriptions of the age of the Antonines use it of the Senate's approval after inquiry. That may be the sense here, that is, avowal of consecration to God after inquiry, having repented and turned to God and now making this public proclamation of that fact by means of baptism (the symbol of the previous inward change of heart). Thus taken, it matters little whether eiß qeon (toward God) be taken with eperwthma or suneidhsewß. Through the resurrection of Jesus Christ (di anastasewß Ihsou Cristou). For baptism is a symbolic picture of the resurrection of Christ as well as of our own spiritual renewal (Romans 6:2-6). See 1 Peter 1:3 for regeneration made possible by the resurrection of Jesus." The Commentary Critical, long noted for it's solid exposition, and time-tested faithfulness says: " vs. 21. whereunto—The oldest manuscripts read, “which”: literally, “which (namely, water, in general; being) the antitype (of the water of the flood) is now saving (the salvation being not yet fully realized by us, compare 1Co 10:1, 2, 5; Jud 1:5; puts into a state of salvation) us also (two oldest manuscripts read ‘you’ for ‘us’: You also, as well as Noah and his party), to wit, baptism.” Water saved Noah not of itself, but by sustaining the ark built in faith, resting on God’s word: it was to him the sign and mean of a kind of regeneration, of the earth. The flood was for Noah a baptism, as the passage through the Red Sea was for the Israelites; by baptism in the flood he and his family were transferred from the old world to the new: from immediate destruction to lengthened probation; from the companionship of the wicked to communion with God; from the severing of all bonds between the creature and the Creator to the privileges of the covenant: so we by spiritual baptism. As there was a Ham who forfeited the privileges of the covenant, so many now. The antitypical water, namely, baptism, saves you also not of itself, nor the mere material water, but the spiritual thing conjoined with it, repentance and faith, of which it is the sign and seal, as Peter proceeds to explain. Compare the union of the sign and thing signified, Jn 3:5; Eph 5:26; Tit 3:5; Heb 10:22; compare 1Jn 5:6. not the, .—“flesh” bears the emphasis. “Not the putting away of the filth of the flesh” (as is done by a mere water baptism, unaccompanied with the Spirit’s baptism, compare Eph 2:11), but of the soul. It is the ark (Christ and His Spirit-filled Church), not the water, which is the instrument of salvation: the water only flowed round the ark; so not the mere water baptism, but the water when accompanied with the Spirit." If "Baptism is immersion in water" as you say, then how whould you explain 1 Cor. 10:1-2: "For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea; and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea;" Two questions come to mind; 1. Who got wet?, and 2. Who died? Those who were "baptized into Moses" were the Egyptians- who's baptism (water) was unto death. Moses and the Israelites, on the other hand recieved a "dry" baptism and lived! Speaking the Truth in Love, BradK |
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4 | MARK 16:16: Was it perverted? | Bible general Archive 2 | Emmaus | 114044 | ||
Brad, "Those who were "baptized into Moses" were the Egyptians- who's baptism (water) was unto death. Moses and the Israelites, on the other hand recieved a "dry" baptism and lived!" I don't see how the actual text supports your interpretation. The "all" repeatedly mention refers to "all our ancestors", the Israelites who were "baptized into Moses" even as are baptized into Christ. The "cloud and the sea" are as the "spirit and water" of baptism. The spiritual "food and drink", manna and water from the rock, are as the Eucharist, body and blood of Christ, the manna come down from heaven, the bread of life. The point Paul is making is that although baptism is important and God "saves" by it, we can still fall away as did many of those Israelites who were " all under the cloud and passed through the sea." "Yet God was not pleased with them and struck them down in the desert." (Numbers 14:26-29; Jude 5) "I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea, and all of them were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. All ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they drank from a spiritual rock that followed them, and the rock was the Christ. Yet God was not pleased with most of them, for they were struck down in the desert. These things happened as examples for us, so that we might not desire evil things, as they did. And do not become idolaters, as some of them did, as it is written, "The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to revel." Let us not indulge in immorality as some of them did, and twenty-three thousand fell within a single day. Let us not test Christ 4 as some of them did, and suffered death by serpents. Do not grumble as some of them did, and suffered death by the destroyer. These things happened to them as an example, and they have been written down as a warning to us, upon whom the end of the ages has come. Therefore, whoever thinks he is standing secure should take care not to fall." So we should avoid overconfidence even if God uses "Spirit and water" baptism to save us, because He saved the Israelites by "the cloud and the sea" but still many fell away and were "struck down" by God in the desert for their idolatry. The same thing can happen to us. Emmaus |
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