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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | A 2nd and 3rd coming of Christ? Intro | Titus 2:13 | kalos | 169798 | ||
A 2nd and 3rd coming of Christ? IV By Rev. Bill Lee-Warner '4. When the student of prophecy studies the writings of the early church fathers, he discovers an interesting phenomenon: the vast majority of the Ante-Nicene Fathers (living between the end of the Apostolic age and A.D. 325) who wrote on the subject of the 2nd coming understood that the church in the latter days would face the persecution of Antichrist, which commences 3 1/2 years after the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel (cf. Daniel 9:27; Matt. 24:15). 'The implication then is that the believer's hope (which includes the anticipation of the rapture) will be realized sometime after the midpoint of the 70th Week and after the beginning of the great tribulation at the hands of Antichrist. If this is the case, and Scripture abundantly supports this view (cf. the sequence in Matt. 24:3-31), then the clear teaching of Scripture on the coming of Christ, both for His church, and with wrath (the Day of the Lord - Zeph 1:14-18, and described as beginning with the cosmic lights being extinguished ((Joel 2:31; Matt. 24:29; Rev. 6:12-17)), is that the Rapture and the Day of the Lord occur on the same day (cf. Luke 17:26-30). Therefore, there is no time separation between the Rapture and the Revelation of Christ. 'The believer on that day will lift his head knowing that his "redemption is drawing near" (Luke 21:28) but the world at the same time will be in "perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, men fainting from fear and the expectation of the things which are coming upon the world, (in context - because of the extinguishing of the cosmic luminaries) for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then will THEY (emphasis added) [in context - the people of the world] see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory." (Luke 1:25-27) 'In light of what Scripture records, Robert Gundry has written, "Every Ante-Nicene writer who wrote in any detail upon the tribulation, resurrection, rapture, or second coming ...[understood] ... the church will undergo persecution at the hands of Antichrist". That means that the Rapture takes place sometime after the persecution starts (the midpoint of the 70th Week) and is not prior to the 70th Week as the pretribulationist insists. Mr. Gundry goes on to say that the only outstanding early fathers missing (that taught differently) were Clement of Alexandria and Origin, who used an allegorical method of interpretation.' ____________________ www.solagroup.org/ articles/faqs/faq_0011.html |
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2 | A 2nd and 3rd coming of Christ? Intro | Titus 2:13 | mark d seyler | 169804 | ||
Hi Kalos, I don't have my books with me, but aren't there only about 4 or 5 references in the Ante-Nicene writings that meantion this topic at all? To say "vast majority" makes it sound like there is this great body of evidence, but was the tribulation even written of in more then a couple of sentences by a few people? I seem to remember that what they actaully wrote was that the church would be raptured at the same time Jesus ended the rule of the beast, at the end of the 70th Week, and not a minute before. While they understood the church would experience the persecution of the antichrist, they also understood that the church would equally experience all the the plagues and judgments of the 70th Week. So that the Ante-Nicene writings are contrary to both the Pre-Trib and Pre-Wrath raptures, in exactly the same way, that all judgments will have been completed before the rapture. So the only rapture model that agrees with the "vast majority" of Ante-Nicene writings is the Post-Tribulation rapture. So while Gundry states that the Ante-Nicene writers agree with him, that the church is persecuted by antichrist, he neglects to state that they disagree with him on the church experiencing the plagues and judgments. Love in Christ, Mark |
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