Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | srchng | 65504 | ||
Must it be either/or, selfish or unselfish? What if we, the redeemed, are the "joy set before Him?" Didn't He have such a relentless passion for fellowship with us that He was willing to go through all that, not to gain power or position (which were already His *good point, Robert*), but to gain US? Wasn't He so wild about us that He, from a human perspective, threw away what could have been a long, happy life - submitted to torture and death so He could have US with Him forever in unbroken fellowship? Wasn't He really being absolutely selfish and absolutely self-sacrificing at the same time, for His own pleasure AND our benefit? Isn't this really the model He gives for husbands - total self sacrifice for the sake of the joy (and even pleasure) of exceeding excellence in intimate, lasting relationship? |
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2 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | Sebkin | 65528 | ||
I think that your analogy makes a lot of sense: "total self sacrifice for the sake of the joy (and even pleasure) of exceeding excellence in intimate, lasting relationship. ". But as far as the concept of Jesus having thrown away a long happy life (I disagree with the concept that he threw away that kind of life). The reason I disagree with that is because He existed in heaven before He came to earth. He was far superior and far happier as God than man. It would be like us becoming a snail and then settling for a long happy life as a snail. That doesn't make sense. But his love and his passion for us caused Him to became a man and then submit to torture and death to salvage us ... now that is a good analogy for the husbands passion for his wife. And I believe that each and every woman who has a husband (christian or not) could benefit greatly if she gave the due respect, fear, and reverence whether she thought her husband deserved it or not. Because man is made in the image of God man has this natural sort of protective, loving, and sacrificial feeling toward his wife. But man also has a sense of justice. And the balance is upset when the wife usurps the mans authority. When this happens the man immediately enters into judgment mode to keep the wife in the place where she belongs. I think your analogy is borne out by: Ephesians 5:25 "Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it." |
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3 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | srchng | 65546 | ||
Dear Sebkin, I knew that was a crude represntation of what I meant when I wrote it. Please forgive me for not being more clear. I only meant that one little aspect of the sacrifice Jesus made (which husbands in general may do well to identify with) was giving up natural self preservation and self interest in the *human* or *temporal* or *natural* sense. Certainly Jesus laying aside or sacrificing these things was a small thing reative to the benefit of the outcome of such investment or faithfulness. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. On the contrary, isn't it also a small thing for a husband to lay aside his *human* or *temporal* or *natural* interests reative to the benefit of the outcome of such investment or faithfulness, both for himself and his wife? Isn't the husband/wife relationship that deeply analogous to the Christ/church relationship? Do you see what I mean? |
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4 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | Sebkin | 65554 | ||
I'm not sure what you mean. Could you give a specific and real example? | ||||||
5 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | srchng | 65569 | ||
Well, there's the rub. It's difficult to come up with a specific and real example of this idea I'm trying to explain when I'm not absolutely sure I understand it completely. I don't know if I've ever seen the thing I'm talking about so I can only get as "real" as a hypothetical scenario. But I'll try to at least make it specific. Let's say, for example, that a husband has interests that are *natural* or *human* or *temporal* and that there is nothing inherently sinful about any of these interests. Some of these interests could be hobbies, sports, political activity, volunteer work, or any number of other things a husband could be interested in for more selfish or less selfish reasons, but not central to the marriage relationship. To make it as "real" as I know how to, let's say volunteer work for a Christian charity and fishing are two serious interests this husband has. There is nothing inherently wrong or sinful about either of these things, but his wife has had a rotten week, has been falsely accused of something at work, feels really guilty because she didn't get in trouble at work for something she really did wrong, and snapped at the kids for arguing for a second about some small thing because she has horrible cramps, and she didn't pay the bills like she said she would, so she's all twisted up inside and feeling like a failure and like everything's completely out of control and really just wants a warm hug and a nice, long cuddle and some hot tea. Isn't it a relatively small sacrifice for the husband to lay aside the volunteer work tonight and the fishing tomorrow and sacrifice that time in an investment in his wife. Even if he doesn't give her the hug, cuddle, and tea, just the way she wishes, doesn't Christ's pattern teach a husband to lay down his life for her in her need? Maybe he has something for her that's much more important than hugs, cuddles and tea. He is God's provision for her in the marriage relationship in a way that I'm trying to get a handle on, but isn't it at least about this kind of sacrifice? |
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6 | Either / or? | Eph 5:33 | Sebkin | 65595 | ||
What you are describing here is the basic conflict between the sexes that exist commonly in our society today. As a man, I will say this. I am forced to take the brunt of life's unfairness without a wimper or a wine or to ask anyone to support me, give me a hug, or push me on. I am expected to pick myself up by my boot strings and keep going. Because of this, I am perfectly oblivious to my wife's need for a hug, or the fact that she has had a hard day. If I knew of it, I would be happy to sacrifice my time and give her those things. But I often do not know about it until it is too late and I've screwed up -- in her sight. Communication is the key here. The woman should not expect the man to know all of these things. And she should make it known. And then once he knows she should allow him to think about it -- because lets face it -- sometimes it takes an hour or so for the simple and the obvious to penetrate a man's sophisticated mind. Men should give time to their wives, their family, and other obligations. Men give the time that they think is needed. Which may or may not be sufficient. So the need must be made known to the man. The man of today faces many problems. His mind is always working on them. But the man's mind is logical and can only work on one problem at a time. Therefore, he must have time to solve the problem his mind is currently working on before it will open up and let him consider another one -- such as his wife needs a hug. There are many more problems than today's man can deal with. And the man does need time by himself. To separate and sort these things. And to become refreshed. The man is a problem solver. If a woman needs a man to sacrifice the volunteer work and the fishing -- the reason has to be made perfectly clear to him. He must weigh and balance and then decide. The answer is not always so obvious to him. But he will never forfeit the volunteer work, or the fishing if he is met with hostility, resentment, or if his authority is usruped. He is a man and he will hold firm that he has a right to these things. But if you want a biblical and reasonable way for a woman to respond to a man to get what she wants out of him ... take a look at Samson and Deliah. Remember that Deliah met Samson with softness, tenderness, with asking, with petitions. She let him be strong. She didn't usurp him. And through this she not only got what she wanted. She conquered him. If an evil woman like this can overcome a man of God by using the common sense to present herself to be in the place where God planned for the women to be ... Just think what a godly woman could do with the same strategy. Modern woman has tried it every other way. Why don't they give God's Word a chance, believe it, and try it for once. It will work out a lot better than they think. Sebkin |
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