Results 1 - 9 of 9
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Morant61 | 50451 | ||
Greetings Raven! None of the verses you quote say that baptism is necessary for salvation (for Acts 2:38 - see my recent post). Further, you didn't really answer my question (or at least I didn't follow your answer). :-) Paul made a distinction between baptism and the Gospel. He said that he was not send to baptize. How could this be true if baptism is essential to salvation, since Paul was sent to preach the Gospel and make disciples? Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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2 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Aspiring Overseer | 50535 | ||
Tim, There are several chapters of Scripture which support the concept of baptism as necessary for salvation, however, the most susinct example I think you will find is the following: 1 Peter 3:21 21And corresponding to that, baptism now saves you-- not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience-- through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, NAS "Baptism now saves you.." That's fairly direct! |
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3 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Morant61 | 50557 | ||
Greetings Aspiring Overseer! Thanks for your response my friend. I have read several of your posts, but have not had the opportunity to interact with you as of yet! If you notice in 1 Pet. 3:21, Peter qualifies his statement that baptism saves by immediately adding - "not the removal of dirt from the flesh". In doing so, he uses the strong adversative 'alla' or 'but'. It is clear that he was afraid that someone might misunderstand what he was saying. Rather, he says, it is either "the response of a good conscience" (NIV) or the "appeal for a good conscience" (NASB). In other words, baptism is either done because of our good conscience or as a prayer for a good conscience. But, baptism does not cleanse. In the Greek, the phrase '- not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience-' is parenthetical. Thus, it is the resurrection of Christ which really saves. Baptism is our response to salvation. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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4 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | kingte1234 | 70384 | ||
ephesians 4:5 one lord, one faith, one baptism. not two, but one. so, which one do you have? water or the holy ghost? flesh is born of flesh, and spirit is spirit. | ||||||
5 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Morant61 | 70416 | ||
Greetings kingt1234! Which do I have? Both! I was baptized in water, and I have been baptized into the body of Christ by the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12:3). Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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6 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Ray | 70426 | ||
Hi Tim, kingte1234 is not a "capitalizer" based on his lower case post. But consider more of what he is saying. I think that he would say that you can't have "one lord, one faith, and one baptism" and have "both" of your baptisms. Of course I would have to tell him that there is a difference between a "lord" and the Lord Jesus Christ. But I agree with him that you can't have one baptism and both. I would say that the only way that you can have both baptisms is by saying that you have been born of "water and *spirit". John 3:5. John 3:3,4, "(Jesus) answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." 4 Nichodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born, can he? 5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the *spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God./ 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the *spirit is spirit." The parenthesis, slash, and stars are mine. The lower case spirit is my interpretation and what I am suggesting would be the only way that you can have both in one. That is, you would be baptized in water and holy spirit. Tim, in your 1 Corinthians passage there is no mention of water. When one speaks by the Spirit of God and says that "Jesus is my Lord", then from that moment on the Holy Spirit indwells him. I see this passage as the indwelling rather than a baptism. 1 Cor 12:3,4 talk about the same (Spirit) and the same Lord. Verse nine speaks of the same Spirit/ and the one Spirit. Verse 11, "But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He (Spirit) wills." Christ is one spiritual body. 1 Corinthians 12:13, "For by one Spirit we were baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit." That is the way I look at these passages of Scripture. (Still penciled in, however) Help me if I need an eraser. From the heart, Ray |
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7 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Morant61 | 70443 | ||
Greetings Ray! I wasn't sure where the poster was going with his question, so I deliberately left it a little vague! :) It is my understanding that Eph. 4:5 refers to water baptism. It is true that all are baptized with only one baptism - water in the name of Christ. However, Scripture (as I think you alluded to) also speaks of a baptism done by the Spirit (1 Cor. 12:2-3) This is not water baptism, and I don't believe that it is view in Eph. 4:5. The 1 Cor. 12:2-3 baptism is a supernatural work done by the Holy Spirit when He places a believer into the Body of Christ. This is also the baptism (even though the word 'baptism' does not occur) which I think is being discussed in John 3:5-6. I don't accept that John 3 is discussing a contrast between water baptism and Spirit baptism. I see it as a contrast between physical (water breaking) birth and spiritual birth (new birth). The word baptism does not occur anywhere in the passage, and John 3:6 contrasts flesh and spirit, not water and spirit. So, I believe that the contrast in John 3:6 relates to those who have only been 'born' and those who have been 'born from above' (which is actually the word translated as 'born again'). Of course, to further complicate things, some would say that there is a baptism 'with' the Holy Spirit subsequent to salvation as well. But, I won't start that whole discussion! The only place I would differ from you capitalization is that I would probably capitalize the first 'Spirit' in John 3:6, since I would see the source of this new birth as being the Holy Spirit. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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8 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Ray | 70470 | ||
Hi Tim, I am afraid that I won't agree with you very much in this post, but bear with me if you will. (1) I am surprised that you would think that if there would be one choice of baptisms that you would choose water. When you say that it is your understanding that Ephesians 4:5 is speaking of water, is this something you have been taught or is it something you have come to understand? 2) I think that we agree (although using different words) when I say that 1 Cor 12 speaks of the "indwelling of the Holy Spirit" and you speak of a believer being placed "into the Body of Christ". We are in Him and He is in us. We are one body, one spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13, "For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body..." 3) John 3:3-8. What I tried to say earlier is that if there is only one baptism we can not have a water and Spirit [sic] scenario; nor a water OR Spirit choice. I do not see water baptism in John 3, either. If there is one baptism then I believe that it is spiritual. I believe that water must be in agreement not in contrast. The way that I see it is that water must be combined with spirit [sic]. The water is the birth process of being born. Then we must be born again from above. This happens when the pneuma or wind or spirit "blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the *spirit. [wind, spirit] We are generated, born, from the spirit or word of God. God wished to come to His own and He spoke words of eternal life, yet they did not know where He came from or where He was going. That is the way of all of us; we have to be born of this holy spirit [wind]. But here I agree with the NKJ for John 3:11, "Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness." In other words, this God/Man spoke earthly and heavenly words and they did not believe. John 3:12, "If I/ told you earthly things and you do not believe, how shall you believe if I tell you heavenly things?" 4) I'd be happy to start in a discussion of being baptized "with"... but perhaps in a different place and time. 5) As far as John 3:6 and being born of the *spirit is concerned, my choice is influenced by the "five words of power" that I spoke of in #3107. I see five words of spiritual power in verses 5-8. It's good to talk with you Tim. From the heart, Ray |
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9 | Why Didn't Paul and Jesus Baptize? | 1 Cor 1:17 | Morant61 | 70474 | ||
Greetings Ray! I'll have to make this brief as I'm heading to bed! 1) Just opinion! I just think it would be more natural for them to think of the initiation rite which all of them had done. But, I could be wrong! :-) 2) I agree! That is what I was trying to say! I believe that every believe is indwelt by the Holy Spirit at the moment he or she is baptized into the Body of Christ by the Holy Spirit. 3) We differ here. I simply see Jesus helping Nicodemus to understand that when He says that we must be born from above that He is not speaking of physical birth, but spiritual birth. 4) Maybe someday! :-) 5) I'm not into numbering! ;-) Merry Christmas my friend! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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