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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | speaking in tongues 1cor.12:1coming | 1 Cor 12:13 | prayon | 125283 | ||
Greetings Songbird, I agree with some of what you say but there are a couple things that were not accurate. The first is when you said "If every believer has been baptized in the Spirit, then it happens at the moment you accept Christ and become a Christian." Actually it does not. Acts 8:14-17 contradicts this. Notice verse 16 in particular "Before this the Holy Spirit had not come to any of the Samaritans. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus." Therefore the baptism of the Holy Ghost does not come automatically when being born again. You also said that tongues is not for every believer. It is a gift to all. Acts tells of 5 instances that tongues were the evidence of the Holy Spirit's indwelling (see Acts 2,8,9,10, and 19), all who were baptized had the evidence of speaking in tongues except for one instance and it was alluded to. Tongues is for all Christians who meet the 5 conditions - Salvation, obedience, faith, asking, and yielding (please see my answer to MrOteng for scriptures and explanations). Mark 16:17 clearly states that those who are believers will speak in new languages "These are the miraculous signs that will accompany believers: They will use the power and authority of my name to force demons out of people. They will speak new languages." He does not say some of the believers he says ALL of the believers. Again in Acts 2:4 it says all believers "All the believers were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other languages as the Spirit gave them the ability to speak". Acts 2:38-39 again says all believers " Peter answered them, "All of you must turn to God and change the way you think and act, and each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins will be forgiven. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift. There are 2 sides to tongues the public side and the private side. This is where the confusion lies. The private side of tongues is what was given in Acts 2,8,9,10 and 19. The private side of tongues is a devotional gift where you speak to God and edify yourself. Public tongues is a ministry gift of the Holy Spirit where you speak for God and edify the church. This gift is not given to everyone. Hope this clears up some stuff. prayon |
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2 | speaking in tongues 1cor.12:1coming | 1 Cor 12:13 | Songbirdca | 125310 | ||
Prayon, 1 Corinthian 12:1 says that believers should not be ignornant of spiritual gifts. It is therefore, good that we are discussing this. Obviously we are of differing opinions. Let me share with you why I believe the way I do about tongues. Taking our guidance from the Word of God I direct you to 1 Corinthians 12. The topic of this chapter is spiritual gifts. Paul's desire is made known in verse two, where he states that he doesn't want us to be led astray. That is good because we want to understand clearly. Read this chapter carefully and you will see that there are a variety of gifts but the same Spirit. (vs. 4) As you read you will notice in verse seven it says, "To each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit". Why is it given? As the rest of the verse says, for the common good. Reading down to verse 11, you will see that many different manifestations of the Spirit are given to believers. Among these manifestations is the gift of tongues. Notice that verse 11 says, that the one and the same Spirit distributes all these things to each one as HE WILLS IT. So who is giving the gifts? God does. Who receives the gifts? All believers (7). Are all believers given the same gifts? NO. Look at verses 28-30 and you will see that in order for the body of Christ to grow we all cannot have the same gift. It would not benefit us as a church body. Are some gifts better than others? No. Clearly this chapter points that out. We are all valuable to the body of Christ. As to the example you have given you must keep it in context. First of all you will remember that this chapter involved Simon the Magician. All the people were following him because of the signs and wonders he was performing, until Philip came and did signs and wonders in Jesus name. When the people saw what Philip could do, in Jesus name, they quickly changed sides. The people were only baptized in the name of Jesus. Notice the word ONLY. They had not yet repented of their sins as is clear when Simon later tries to buy the gift of the Holy Spirit from Peter and John (18-23). Yes, tongues is an evidence of the Holy Spirit's dwelling, but so is prophecy, teaching, interpretation of tongues, etc. these are all gifts of the Holy Spirit manifested in us as a sign from God that He is with us, again I point you to 1 Cor. 12. All these gifts are given to us for God's glory and to build up and unite the body of Christ. Can we ask for gifts? No. For again scripture clearly states that the Holy Spirit gives the gifts as He wills it. 1 Cor.12:11. We must also try to remember that tongues are a sign for unbelievers. (1 cor. 14:22) As evidenced by the many who heard the Apostles speak in their own languages on Pentecost and many were saved. Tongues was obviously a gift needed to reach the masses. Today the gift of tongues has unfortunately been elevated by some Christians as THE gift. That only people with the gift of tongues are saved. As Scripture clearly points out, that is simply not true. Which is why Paul wrote to the Corinthians in the first place, because people back then were also trying to make tongues more important than any of the other gifts. For someone to say that the Holy Spirit only gives the manifestation of tongues at our rebirth, would be a contradiction of scripture. Blessings, Songbirdca |
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3 | speaking in tongues 1cor.12:1coming | 1 Cor 12:13 | prayon | 125316 | ||
Greetings Songbird, YOu are right we do have different opinions. I go by the 5 instances of the baptism of the Spirit given in Acts. In each instance the evidence of speaking in tongues was given as a sign of baptism in the Holy Spirit. There is not record of any kind that one person did failed to receive the Spirit. Jesus said in Mark 16:17 "These are the miraculous signs that will accompany believers: They will use the power and authority of my name to force demons out of people. They will speak new languages. Jesus didn't say that some of the believers would speak in new tongues. He said that speaking in tongues would accompany those that believed. YOu said that we cannot ask for a gift. I disagree. I believe that if we can ask for any gift but whether we get it or not is up to God. For example if there was one thing that I am not it is discerning. I prayed repeatedly for the gift of discernment and God gave it to me. I sincerely believe that this gift was of no part of me before I received it. In your last sentence are you saying that you don't have to be reborn or saved to speak in tongues? prayon |
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4 | speaking in tongues 1cor.12:1coming | 1 Cor 12:13 | Morant61 | 125344 | ||
Greetings Prayon! It is good to see you posting again my friend! I fully agree with you that there is no reason that we cannot ask for a gift. Scripture says to 'eagerly desire the greater gifts' (1 Cor. 12:31). I would slightly differ with you on two points. 1) First of all, it is extremely diffcult and dangerous to base doctrine upon narrative passages. So, while it is certainly true that the narratives usually include tongues at the baptism of the Holy Spirit, there is no teaching passage that state this must always be the case. 2) Secondly, the longer ending of Mark is very questionable. As with narrative passages, I would be very cautious about basing a doctrine upon the longer ending of Mark. To illustrate, Mark 16 also says that believers will drink poison and handle snakes. Has every believer done this? :-) I do firmly believe that the church needs to rely less upon her own abilities and more upon the gifts of the Spirit. By ignoring the gifts, we have lost much of our power for ministry. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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