Results 1 - 12 of 12
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 77968 | ||
Are the people being told to be baptized in Acts 2:38 the same number, no more or less, than those being told to repent? Are the same people that the Holy Spirit fell on in Acts 2:3 the same number, no more or less, as those whom it appeared to? |
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2 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79167 | ||
Since no one wants to answer, I will. The command to "repent YE" is 2nd plural command. This command is joined by the conjunction 'and' (kai) followed with the 2nd command "let each one of YE be baptized". The second command is appositive to the command to 'repent', and even though the verb (baptistheito) is 3rd singular the number being commanded are the same as the number told to 'repent.' This is so because 'each one' [HEKASTOS] is followed with the 2nd person plural pronoun, 'of YE.' And Thayer says HEKASTOS (nominative, singular, adjective), "when it denotes individually, every one of many, is often added appositively to nouns, pronouns, and verbs in plural. Which is what is done in this instance. So when someone says that the command to be baptized isn't associated with receiving the forgiveness of sins because of the change in number and person, tell them the grammar allows it and 52 translations of the Bible accurately depict it so. The same people commanded by Peter to repent for forgiveness of sins were also commanded to be baptized for forgiveness of sins. Salvation comes only by the blood of Christ through the obedience of faith. Have you been baptized 'for the remission of your sins'? Good day, Disciplerami |
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3 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | Searcher56 | 79247 | ||
Disciplerami ... This was answered. 1. This was moved from Unanswered to Answered in less than an hour 2. I posted ID# 77972 ... go read it. Tim and I have already discussed the type of pronouns. Did you forget? The translations fail us, ashave been pointed out. Acts 10:44-48 proves our point. I (We) doubt you will ever change. Searcher |
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4 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79254 | ||
Searcher, The person who is searching for the truth will decide whether you've answered anything. Good day. Disciplerami |
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5 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | Searcher56 | 79259 | ||
Disciplerami, You asked ... "Are the people being told to be baptized in Acts 2:38 the same number, no more or less, than those being told to repent?" I answered ... "We don't know the number who were told to repent ... we are told a crowd (vs 6) and 3,000 accepted the message and were baptized (vs 41). Since verse 6 doesn't say, the anwser is we don't know. In Acts 4:4, we see the number 5,000 ... if these added were part of the crowd ... the answer is no." You asked, "Are the same people that the Holy Spirit fell on in Acts 2:3 the same number, no more or less, as those whom it appeared to?" I answered ... "Verse 1 says they were "all together", verse 3 says "each of them" and verse 4 says "all of them" ... so the answer is yes." Did I not answer your question? If I answered it wrong, you should have clarified it ... maybe you asked it wrong, when you didn't ask about the numbers based on the Greek pronouns. Which I since showed you Tim (and I) have already answered. Searcher |
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6 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79298 | ||
Searcher, Thank you. The Greek in verse 2:3 and verse 2:38 is the same and so everyone who was told to repent was also told to be baptized. My point was not to determine the exact number that was present that day; instead I made the point that the verbs 'repent' and 'be baptized', though one was 3rd singular and one is 2nd plural, are to the same crowd and both are required of all in order to receive forgiveness of sins. Have a good day. Disciplerami |
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7 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | Morant61 | 79303 | ||
Greetings Disciplerami! I know that will probably never see eye to eye on Acts 2:38, but why do you keep saying that the Greek is the same in both verses? They aren't! Just to note a few of the differences: In Acts 2:3, the phrase is 'each of them' (3rd person pronoun). There isn't any imperative, not a result clause. The phrase 'each of them' is the direct object, not the subject. In Acts 2:38, the phrase is 'each of you' (2nd person pronoun). The phrase is the subject of the clause. And it is mixed in with other clauses, with which it cannot be grammatically connected. For the Greek to be the 'same', both verse would have to say the same thing in exactly the same way. This is not the case with these two verses. Acts 2:3 does not support in any way your intepretation of Acts 2:38. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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8 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79305 | ||
They are. You keep saying the 3rd Singular 'be baptized' doesn't related to the same ones being told to repent, and you are wrong. Disciplerami |
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9 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | Morant61 | 79309 | ||
Greetings Disciplerami! First, let's be clear on what I have and have not said. I have not said that those being commanded to 'be baptized' are not included in the number of those being told 'to repent'. What I have said is that the command 'to be baptized' is not grammatically connected to the result clause 'for the forgiveness of your sins and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit'. These two 'results' can only be grammatically connected to the command 'to repent'. This is true to the Greek grammar and true to the context of Acts itself. For, in Acts 10, we see this very thing demonstrated. People, who have not yet been baptized, received the 'gift of the Holy Spirit' (by the way, the Greek here IS identical to that of Acts 2:38). Under my interpretation of Acts 2:38, this makes perfect sense. Under your interpretation of Acts 2:38, this is a contradiction. So, answer this my friend. If one must both repent and be baptized to receive the promises of Acts 2:38, how did those in Acts 10 receive one of the promises even though they had not yet been baptized? The best that you can do is to either ignore the passage altogether, or claim some sort of special circumstance (which the text does not mention). :-) Baptism is done in response to salvation, not in order to gain salvation. What did Peter say? Acts 10:47 - "Can anyone keep these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have." They were baptized because they were saved, not to get saved. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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10 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79336 | ||
Greetings, And I have said that I disagree with this statement: "What I have said is that the command 'to be baptized' is not grammatically connected to the result clause 'for the forgiveness of your sins and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit'. These two 'results' can only be grammatically connected to the command 'to repent" Both the command to repent and be baptized are connected grammatically with the conjunction 'and'. The promised result of 'forgiveness' is to the same ones who are told to be baptized. You continue to suggest that the English just can't quite relate the nuances, but we aren't talking about nuances. We are talking about an entire restructure of the original text. You do not simply speak of nuances when you clip and paste Greek text. The command to 'be baptized' is not an afterthought, better stuck on the tail of the verse, not since the Holy Spirit placed it between the command to repent and the promise of forgiveness. Your problem is not in an inability to relate nuances, it is with the original text. We probably won't agree. I'm sorry. I wish you well, Disciplerami |
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11 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | Morant61 | 79339 | ||
Greetings Disciplerami! I just wanted to be clear about what I objected to in Acts 2:38. Concerning your claim that I have a problem with the Greek text, this is not true. I have a problem with your interpretation of the Greek text. The text is perfectly clear. In English, if I want to make a parenthetical statement (such as this one), I can include it in brackets or seperate it from the rest of the sentence with commas. The Greek language had an even more effective way of doing this, I could change the person and number of a clause, which changes the very form of the words themselves, and accompish what English can only do very clumsly. This is what Acts 2:38 does, as Dr. Robertson also affirms. I have no problem with the text, just your insistence that Peter ignored the rules of grammar! :-) You still haven't addressed the Acts 10 question. If you interpretation of Acts 2:38 is correct, then those in Acts 10 could not have received 'the gift of the Holy Spirit' without both repenting and be baptized. Yet, they did. Why? Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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12 | Repent and Baptism for same number? | Acts 2:38 | disciplerami | 79353 | ||
Greetings, see 79352 for answer. | ||||||