Results 1 - 7 of 7
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | srbaegon | 118481 | ||
Hello bstudent, Concerning God's foreknowing: Isaiah 46:8-11 (ESV) "Remember this and stand firm, recall it to mind, you transgressors, [9] remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, [10] declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,' [11] calling a bird of prey from the east, the man of my counsel from a far country. I have spoken, and I will bring it to pass; I have purposed, and I will do it. Regarding God's foreknowing and foreordaining an evil thing: Acts 2:22-23 (ESV) "Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know— [23] this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men. Steve |
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2 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | bstudent | 118484 | ||
I like how the ESV translation highlights what a purposeful God he is. All God has ever promised either has been or will be accomplished! My only concern is that people will logically conclude (if we cannot demonstrate Scripturally that God does not always choose to know the future, nor does he need to know every detail about it to accomplish his will) that God is the cause of everything that happens. On the other hand, we need to prove that no human or spirit creature could possibly prevent God from fulfilling his word. Humans can predict the future with very limited success and virtually no ability to control it. God on the other hand can accurately foretell the future, and in addition, see the heart. He knew that "stiff-necked" Israel would, as a whole, reject his son. After all he witnessed as they persecuted and killed the prophets he sent previously to bring about a change of heart. He pleaded not for the many that he knew would not listen, but for the relative few he knew that would. How did he know? He made us. He knows our capabilities. The many prophecies about specific details carefully recorded for the honest-hearted to identify the Messiah were facts he foresaw from his look at the future. 2 Peter 3:9 states: "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance." The concepts of patience and wishing can not coexist with foreknowledge of the kind that many imagine. Many of God's other awesome qualities, such as love, justice, wisdom, depend on his limiting his ability to foresee the future. Just as his love does not restrain his power, but works perfectly together, so it is with his foreknowledge. |
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3 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | srbaegon | 118489 | ||
Hello bstudent, As Tim Moran has pointed out, foreknowledge and foreordination are separate issues that can be confused. You are correct that we proceed with caution. However, foreknowing does not logically lead to foreordaining. I offer the following: Luke 10:13 (ESV) "Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the mighty works done in you had been done in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago, sitting in sackcloth and ashes. Here is a clear example of God knowing what would happen under a set of conditions, yet it never does. This demonstrates that God knows all--both the real and the potential. Can you demonstrate Scripturally that God does not always choose to know the future? I haven't seen it, although I haven't read all your posts either. Steve |
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4 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | bstudent | 118581 | ||
Steve, I would interpret Jesus statement at Luke 10:13 as hyperbole, in the sense of Luke 18:25. My reason for saying this relates to God's ability to read hearts and his justice. If God used his foreknowledge to determine that these people would have responded positively to the works Jesus did, he would not have grounds for executing them. Likewise, when armageddon comes, God will have to determine whether each of the relatively few that have not had the opportunity to respond to the good news, repenting and dedicating their life to God on the basis of the ransom, will be destroyed or not. The following supports God's selective use of his ability to foresee the future: The Scriptures say that “God put Abraham to the test” by commanding him to sacrifice his son Isaac as a burnt offering. When Abraham was about to sacrifice Isaac, God stopped him and said: “Now I do know that you are God-fearing in that you have not withheld your son, your only one, from me.” (Genesis 22:1-12) Would God have made that statement if he knew in advance that Abraham would obey this command? Would it have been an honest test? Genesis 18:20,21 states: "Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know." Furthermore, the ancient prophets report that God repeatedly spoke of himself as ‘feeling regret’ over something he had done or was thinking of doing. For example, God said that he “regretted [from the Hebrew na·cham'] that he had made Saul king over Israel.” (1 Samuel 15:11, 35; compare Jeremiah 18:7-10; Jonah 3:10.) Because God is perfect, these verses cannot mean that God made a mistake in selecting Saul to be Israel’s first king. Rather, they must indicate that God felt sorry that Saul turned out to be faithless and disobedient. God’s using such an expression in referring to himself would be nonsensical if he had foreknown Saul’s actions. The same term appears in the most ancient of the Scriptures where, in referring to the days of Noah, it says: “The LORD felt regrets that he had made men in the earth, and he felt hurt at his heart. So Jehovah said: ‘I am going to wipe men whom I have created off the surface of the ground . . . because I do regret that I have made them.’” (Genesis 6:6, 7) Here again, this indicates that man’s actions are not predestined by God. God felt regret, grief, and even hurt, not because his own actions were mistaken, but because man’s wickedness became rife. The Creator regretted that it had become necessary to destroy all mankind except Noah and his family. God assures us: ‘I take no delight in the death of the wicked.’—Ezekiel 33:11; compare Deuteronomy 32:4, 5. Hope this proves helpful. Dan |
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5 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | srbaegon | 118591 | ||
Hello Dan, You said: "I would interpret Jesus statement at Luke 10:13 as hyperbole, in the sense of Luke 18:25" and then gave an explanation based from your theological view rather than let the text speak for itself making your assumption invalid. Concerning Abraham, you asked: 1. "Would God have made that statement if he knew in advance that Abraham would obey this command?" I don't see why not. It's a statement of assurance in Abraham's faith spoken for his benefit. 2. "Would it have been an honest test?" Definitely. Tests are designed to prove the character of the person (1 Cor 10:13; James 1:2-4; 1 Pet 1:6-7). Concerning Gen 18:20-21: Again this was stated for another's (Abraham) sake. God gave Abraham an opportunity to show his heart by interceding for the cities on behalf of any righteous. Let's face facts. The only Scripture which you can possibly consider using is Gen 6:6-7. All the others deal with God explaining His actions for the benefit of men. Again I quote: "Here again, this indicates that man’s actions are not predestined by God." And, yet, I showed you a passage in Acts that stated otherwise. How is this resolved? Steve |
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6 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | bstudent | 118593 | ||
Have you ever read about the contributions that belief in evolution has made to the inhumane treatment man has heaped upon his neighbors? I feel belief in predestination has yielded similar fruitage. Might makes right - the U.S. is the greatest, so it is his instrument. I'll continue worshiping my God and I'm sure you'll continue worshiping your's. Let's leave it at that. |
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7 | How does foreknowledge preclude free? | Gen 6:6 | srbaegon | 118595 | ||
Hello Dan, Your response is typical of those who cannot respond to the truth. Steve |
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