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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | naming and subordination | Gen 3:20 | Beja | 213409 | ||
1 Cor 11:8 involves a highly disputed passage which speaks of men having authority over women and how that plays out in church. The details of the passage are not what I draw attention to so much as the basis for which Paul anchors his male authority view point. In verse 8 he says, "For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man." (NASB) Let us move to a second verse which we find in 1 Timothy chapter 2. 1tim 2:11,12 states that women are not allowed to teach or have authority over a man within the church. Once again the interesting thing to note is the reasons for which Paul states this. The first of his two reasons is stated in verse 13 when he says, "For it was Adam who was first created and then Eve." He does then go on to state what happened in the fall as a second reason. My concluding statement to your first question is this: it does seem that Paul set forth what took place in creation (prior to the fall) as a reason of the husband being head over the wife. I don't submit this as absolute conclusive proof, but I think since scripture doesn't explicitly anywhere state whether it was based on the fall or creation then these two verses should definitly lean us towards a creation view. As for your second question I believe the answer is yes, it did signify his authority over her. However I know of nowhere that scripture states this and it would have to be backed up from simply viewing extrabiblical traditions and studying the Jewish mind set. So I put forth this part of my response most humbly as my opinion. Hope the first part was helpful, Beja |
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2 | naming and subordination | Gen 3:20 | keliy | 213412 | ||
Shalom pastor Beja, I would like to comment on some details in your post, if I may. In reading your words, I see that you refer to 1Cor 11:8 as a highly disputed passage. ( I agree, and think how these verses are played out may never be resolved to everyone's satisfaction) -Although God's word is very clear. But I see the basis for man's authority going beyond what you have mentioned in verse 8. Near the end of Gen 2, when God formed every kind of animal and bird, He brought them to Adam to choose a name for each one. This was prior to woman ever being mentioned. What this says to me is that God had a relationship with man, and He bestowed upon this man a knowledge of His will. So, this actually is saying less about who was 'older' per se, but brings into play the rank of the 'firstborn' and the relationship that the firstborn has with the father. It is the same reason that I see for why a woman is not allowed to have authority over man. It is no different with my older brother, and I would be wrong to try to exercise misplaced authority over him (not that I never try ;o) And it actually has less to do with gender, because I have an older sister too, and I defer to her out of respect, without feeling that I am disobeying Paul's command. This has nothing to do with the fall, or the creation, but as you said, Paul was setting forth what took place in creation prior to the fall. Just my viewpoint, and I thought I would add a little 'flavor' to your post. blessings, keliy |
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3 | naming and subordination | Gen 3:20 | Beja | 213413 | ||
The basis for man's authority certainly goes beyond what I posted. My post was only attempting to show that it was not something that was contingent on the fall. By showing that there were verses that indicated the authority was in place prior to the fall (1 Cor 11:8 and the 1 timothy passage) it proves only one thing: man's authority was not because of the fall. Hence answering the original question of whether it was based on the fall or not. What it is in fact based on and a detailed account of what these passages are trying to teach is not something I'm intending to even hint at. Hope that helps to clarify my post. In love, beja |
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4 | naming and subordination | Gen 3:20 | keliy | 213414 | ||
Yes, Thank you Beja. Your original post was clear,and now it is further defined. Lord Bless, keliy |
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