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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | nature of the holy spirit of god | Bible general Archive 3 | gdh1127 | 180050 | ||
hi tim! below is a response i made for jeff but it also mentions the above verses you cited: Hi Jeff! So sorry I could only get back to you now. You must know that what is important to me is what the bible really teaches. I am not out to defend any doctrine taught by churches. Here are my thoughts on your response for whatever they are worth *_*. Now on to Mark 13:11 and Luke 12:12. If only there are no passages in the bible in the Greek manuscripts that use a pronoun for the Holy Spirit in the neuter gender I would naturally think the Holy Spirit is a person. But this is not so as in the sample verses below. The pronouns in the English translation are in the third person, but in Greek, they are in neuter gender. Jn 14:26 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He (Gk 1565 ekeinos) will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. Jn 16:13 13 However, when He (Gk 1565, ekeinos), the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. Jn 16:14 14 He (Gk 1565, ekeinos) will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. Here is the definition of the original Greek word bolded and underlined above: ekeinos NT:1565 ekeinos (ek-i'-nos); from NT:1563; that one (or [neuter] thing); often intensified by the art. prefixed: (Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.) So although the pronoun in the English translation is that of a third person, it is actually in neuter in the Greek language. Also, Mark 13:11 and Luke 12:12 do not prove the personhood of the Holy Spirit. In the following, the spirit of Job drinks; that of Asaph makes diligent search; that of King Nabuchadnezzar, was anxious to know; and that of man, knows the things in man. Job 6:4 4 For the arrows of the Almighty are within me; My spirit (Hebrew 7307 ruwach) drinks in their poison; The terrors of God are arrayed against me. Ps 77:6 6 I call to remembrance my song in the night; I meditate within my heart, And my spirit (Hebrew 7307 ruwach) makes diligent search. Da 2:3 3 And the king said to them, "I have had a dream, and my spirit (Hebrew 7307 ruwach) is anxious to know the dream." 1 Co 2:11 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit (Greek 4151 pneuma) of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit (Greek Pneuma) of God. The verses that seem to me to imply a separate personhood are the following: Mt 28:19 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 2 Co 13:14 14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you all. Amen. Ge 1:1 - 2 Th 2:13 13 Stand Fast But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, But then again, we know that God the Father is a spirit; so is the Christ and the angels. The pronoun Scriptures assigned to them is that of third person. So why would the neuter pronoun be used of the Holy Spirit? Should you have any insight into any of the above, I would appreciate knowing them *_*. Take care, Grace |
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2 | nature of the holy spirit of god | Bible general Archive 3 | Morant61 | 180056 | ||
Greetings Gdh1127! Thanks for the reply! May I respond to your points? If I remember correctly, you mentioned that you have not had training in Greek. Allow me to point out something which may be causing some confusion and something which also points to the personhood of the Holy Spirit. The 'gender' of nouns is more a function of form than anything else. What do I mean by this? Nouns must have a form connected with them, thus some nouns are masculine, some nouns are feminine, while others are neuter. In some cases, the reason for the gender is obvious. For instance, 'man' is masculine, while 'woman' is feminine. :) In other cases, though, the reason is not apparent. 'Spirit' is neuter in form. Thus, grammatically, all of the articles and pronouns which have it as their antecedent must also be neuter in form. However, this does not necessarily mean that the Holy Spirit is not a person. It simply means that the form of the word is neuter. Interestingly, since the form of the word is neuter, grammatical rules require that all of the pronouns that refer to 'spirit' must also be neuter in form. However, in many instances, the pronouns are not neuter, but masculine. Two of the examples you used in your post incorrectly identified the pronoun as neuter when they were in fact masculine in form. The two examples are: John 14:26, and John 16:13-14. In both of these passages, 'ekeinos' is in the masculine form. Why would Scripture break the 'rule' in these cases? I believe it is because the Scripture writers were hesitant to use the neuter form for the Holy Spirit, Whom they certainly viewed as a person and not a thing! p.s. - I wanted to note that my other example (Eph. 1:14) has some textual variants involved, but John 16:13-14 do not. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | nature of the holy spirit of god | Bible general Archive 3 | kalos | 180060 | ||
Tim, Thank you for your excellent explanation. Gracia y paz (Grace and peace), John |
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