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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | The Spirit and the Seventy | John 16:7 | ariel levin | 223323 | ||
Shalom everyone, I think this is my first question. I've watched this site for a number of years and have not seen this question before. It's one of those dreaded "why" questions...maybe I'll make it a "how come" question. :o) How come Messiah told His disciples that He had to go away for the Holy Spirit to come to them? The Holy Spirit was given in full measure to Moses, and then later to his 70 elders. It was the same Spirit, and the trinitarian doctrine teaches that the Spirit is a distinct personality of the Godhead, so Messiah's being on the earth or not being here should have nothing to do with whether the Spirit indwells or not? I'm just a bit confused over the having to "go away" and the infilling of the 70 along with Moses (and probably Aaron and Miriam too)? Thanks for the help. |
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2 | The Spirit and the Seventy | John 16:7 | Morant61 | 223324 | ||
Greetings Ariel Levin! 'Why' questions are tough, unless Scripture gives us a direct answer. I'm not sure which verse you referencing concerning Moses and the 70 elders, but usually in the Old Testament, the Holy Spirit only came upon people for a time. After Christ, the Holy Spirit now indwells all of His people, all of the time. Here is how Albert Barnes explains it: ************** Joh 16:7 It is expedient for you ... - The reason why it was expedient for them that he should go away, he states to be, that in this way only would the Comforter be granted to them. Still, it may be asked why the presence of the Holy Spirit was more valuable to them than that of the Saviour himself? To this it may be answered: 1. That by his departure, his death, and ascension - by having these great facts before their eyes they would be led by the Holy Spirit to see more fully the design of his coming than they would by his presence. While he was with them, notwithstanding the plainest teaching, their minds were filled with prejudice and error. They still adhered to the expectation of a temporal kingdom, and were unwilling to believe that he was to die. When he should have actually left them they could no longer doubt on this subject, and would be prepared to understand why he came. And this was done. See the Acts of the Apostles everywhere. It is often needful that God should visit us with severe affliction before our pride will be humbled and we are willing to understand the plainest truths. 2. While on the earth the Lord Jesus could be bodily present but in one place at one time. Yet, in order to secure the great design of saving men, it was needful that there should be some agent who could be in all places, who could attend all ministers, and who could, at the same time, apply the work of Christ to people in all parts of the earth. 3. It was an evident arrangement in the great plan of redemption that each of the persons of the Trinity should perform a part. As it was not the work of the Spirit to make an atonement, so it was not the work of the Saviour to apply it. And until the Lord Jesus had performed this great work, the way was not open for the Holy Spirit to descend to perform his part of the great plan; yet, when the Saviour had completed his portion of the work and had left the earth, the Spirit would carry forward the same plan and apply it to men. 4. It was to be expected that far more signal success would attend the preaching of the gospel when the atonement was actually made than before. It was the office of the Spirit to carry forward the work only when the Saviour had died and ascended; and this was actually the case. See Acts 2. Hence, it was expedient that the Lord Jesus should go away, that the Spirit might descend and apply the work to sinners. The departure of the Lord Jesus was to the apostles a source of deep affliction, but had they seen the whole case they would not have been thus afflicted. So God often takes away from us one blessing that he may bestow a greater. All affliction, if received in a proper manner, is of this description; and could the afflicted people of God always see the whole case as God sees it, they would think and feel, as he does, that it was best for them to be thus afflicted. It is expedient - It is better for you. ******* I hope this helps! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | The Spirit and the Seventy | John 16:7 | ariel levin | 223325 | ||
Thank you, Mr. Moran, for your time and effort. It's much appreciated. Barnes doesn't fully satisfy, but it is a valid view to consider with some interesting points that I hadn't "seen" before. (I'm under the impression due to the circumstances that Moses and the 70 each received the "full measure" of the Spirit and that it lasted, remained within them, until each individual died.) |
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4 | The Spirit and the Seventy | John 16:7 | Morant61 | 223327 | ||
Greetings Ariel Levin! Please, just call me 'Tim'! :-) I feel old enough as it is! ;-) I don't always agree with Barnes, but he usually makes some good observations. I assume that you are talking about the 70 in Numbers 11. If so, I don't so any conflict with Barnes' statements. The 70 received a portion of the Spirit from Moses to accomplish a specific task. Nothing is said in Scripture about whether or not the Spirit stayed on them at all times or only when they were performing that specific task. Neither is anything said about how long the Spirit stayed upon them. Either way, the coming of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament is vastly different in both extent and nature. Christ promised us that the Holy Spirit would indwell all believers, forever. Great question my friend! Let us know if you find any more information about it. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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