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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Should we rethink the Trinity? | John 10:30 | Saint N Says | 135513 | ||
There were great wars over the trinity doctrine in the early church, is there good reason to reconsider this? John 10:22-39 “I and the Father are One.” John 10:30 is equal to saying: We are one and the same. The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. John 10:31 The Jews gathered around Jesus at the time Dedication. They had very high Messianic expectations, wanted Jesus to claim to be that, but in seconds went from desire to follow to desire to kill. “There is no difference between us.” is equal to saying: “If you have seen Me you have seen the Father.” Jesus was deeply hated by the Jews because He directly claimed that He and God were one and the same. The Jews despised the Romans and would want not one of their own turned over for crucifixion. Something had to offend them more deeply than any other thing could for them to demand that outcome, a result the Romans were loathe to take. John 14:7-21 |
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2 | Should we rethink the Trinity? | John 10:30 | Morant61 | 135514 | ||
Greetings! There are two verses in John that make it quite clear that saying 'we are one' does not mean 'one and the same'. John 17:11 says of believers, "I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name—the name you gave me—so that they may be one as we are one." And, John 17:22 says of believers, "I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one:" If we can be one as Jesus and the Father are one, then clearly they are not 'one and the same', since we are not 'one and the same'. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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3 | Should we rethink the Trinity? | John 10:30 | Saint N Says | 135517 | ||
That simply sounds like a pat answer. I think it reflects a Western approach to logic, that did not exist in that ancient Eastern culture. Maybe Jesus meant what He actually said, and not what we are comfortable with it meaning. I think the fact that they went from wanting to follow him to killing him indicates that he said something immensely offensive. I would conclude that unless we find what He said offensive we probably haven't understood Him yet. | ||||||
4 | Should we rethink the Trinity? | John 10:30 | Morant61 | 135551 | ||
Greetings! Is it a pat answer to look at what Scripture actually says? :-) You were basing your position on a perceived understanding of the phrase 'we are one'. I simply looked at how that phrase was used in John. The same phrase is used of the relationship between believers. Thus, it must not mean 'one and the same person'. I do agree that the Pharisees found Jesus' comments offensive. However, the doctrine of the Trinity fully accounts for that offense. Jesus was fully God and the Jews understood that His comments made Him equal to God. Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |
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