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NASB | John 8:24 "Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins." |
AMPLIFIED 2015 | John 8:24 "That is why I told you that you will die [unforgiven and condemned] in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am the One [I claim to be], you will die in your sins." [Ex 3:14; Matt 24:5; Mark 13:6; Luke 21:8] |
Bible Question:
Hey Tim, Thanks for all the scripture on what we are required to believe. It was like playing the game I-SPY the perversion. And I spied your perversion to the gospel only because I know your interpretation to John 8:24. Look at all the beautiful verses that tell people they are required to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. And then there's John 8:24 that sticks out like a sore thumb. This is the only verse that supposedly requires a person to believe that Jesus is actually Yahweh Himself and not the Son of God. Isn't this suspicious to you Tim? And then you said in one of your posts that the context calls for this "I AM" to be a Divine title. Did you read the next verse (8:25). The response of the Jews screams the exact opposite of a Divine title when they ask "Who are you?" Why did they ask that? Didn't Jesus just tell them in verse 24 that He is Yahweh. Tim, I'm sorry but I have to call you out that you are perverting the gospel with your interpretation to John 8:24. Your adding to the gospel by requiring a person to believe in a Binity in order to be saved. You are adding to the doctrine of salvation with the wrong interpretation of John 8:24. I would even start at the foundation and make sure Exodus 3:14 (I am that I am) should even be translated that way. Are you going to let one controversial verse (John 8:24) which is built upon another ambiguous verse (Exodus 3:14) add to the truth of your gospel. This sure changes John 3:16 to read, For God so loved the world that He sent Himself. I don't think you're going to answer my question if the Trinitarian Protestant Church can be a true religion. Who am I kidding, I think I know the answer. The answer is NO! There could be partial truth to the religion but it's really about trying to find the right gospel within the Trinitarian Protestant religion. A religion can't be entirely true if people within the religion can't even agree on the requirement of belief needed for salvation. I hope this post is not too divisive but their is nothing more divisive than telling someone they will "die in their sins" because of a poor interpretation one way or another. Tim, this is important so let's feed off of one another and let's get the gospel right. So let me start with the first question. Did the blind man in John 9:9 claim he was God when he said the "Divine Name - I am" (ego eimi in greek) when saying he was the blind man. By the way, I would like to congratulate you on being saved at the age of six. That's awesome! I don't think I even new my phone number or address when I was six let alone know the nature of Jesus and that the Son of God can also be God. That's incredible! God Bless, Andy |
Bible Answer: Greetings Andy! Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I work nights, so there maybe a little lag in our conversation. Allow me to touch upon a couple of things. 1) My purpose behind the quotes was to demonstrate two things. First of all, there is very little that Scripture says we are required to believe in order to be saved. As you noted, most six year old kids don't even know their address. I did, but that is beside the point. :-) Secondly, there is no mention that we must understand the Trinity in order to be saved. But, we do need to understand the true nature of Jesus. He is fully God. He is also fully man. We can't be saved if we simply view Him as being a 'good teacher'. So, I would maintain that accepting Jesus as the "I am" is not a perversion of the Gospel, but the heart of it. Thus far, you have not articulated your position. Most who reject the Trinity either take one of two position. One, they believe that Jesus is a lesser being than the Father. Or, two, they believe that Jesus, Father, and Spirit are all just one name for one Person. Which position do you hold? 2) Blind man: The blind man was responding the questions about whether or not he was the man born blind. He responded, "I am." Using the 'to be' verb much in the same way that we do. However, Jesus makes a statement in John 8:24 that would not make sense in the ordinary usage of the word. You must believe that 'I exist'. Jesus was standing right in front of them. Of course, they knew that He existed. ;-) He meant something else. I believe He was appealing back to Ex. 3:14. The discussion progresses and finally in John 8:58, Jesus makes a claim that can only be true of God, not any mere man, using the 'I am' in a dual sense. Jesus was claiming to be God, and stating that He existed in the time of Abraham. 3) I'll address your Ex. 3:14 question in your other post my friend! Your Brother in Christ, Tim Moran |