Results 61 - 80 of 92
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: LuckyCharm Ordered by Verse |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
61 | Suffering automatically sanctified? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44805 | ||
Excellent observations, Makarios! So, I'm wondering about your qualification of suffering that is done "in His name": Are you referring to the practice of consciously "offering up" our trials in prayer as part of becoming a "living sacrifice" (Rom 12:1)? Or do our sufferings become sanctified through Him regardless? Perhaps the Holy Spirit offers them on our behalf, even when we do not consciously do so ourselves? --Cheryl |
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62 | Seeking out suffering? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44810 | ||
Thank you for your comments, New Creature! Yes, He did tell us that no servant is greater than his Master (John 13:16). If we follow Him who suffered so much for us, we can expect to suffer ourselves... I am wondering, though, considering everything that has been said in this thread so far -- couldn't this view of suffering lead us to seek out suffering unnecessarily or arbitrarily? There would be nothing holy about that, or would there? Some people seem to do this subconsciously anyway -- instead of seeking out further suffering, shouldn't they be seeking ways to overcome their circumstances wherever possible, to the glory of God? Even Jesus prayed that the cup be taken from Him, if possible. Yet He emphasized that He was laying down His life of His own accord (John 10:11, 18) and even rebuked Peter for trying to interfere with His arrest in the Garden. Is this because He was fully divine, and only did the Father's will? And is this the example we are to follow in every circumstance? What about, for instance, a Christian woman caught in an abusive marriage? Even if her suffering is sanctified through Christ, should she not seek to escape it if possible? --Cheryl |
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63 | Seeking out suffering? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44812 | ||
Hello again Makarios, and thank you for your prompt reply! So far we've only been discussing unavoidable suffering. But are there cases (like fasting) where suffering is legitimately to be sought? And aren't there times when suffering is wrongly sought, consciously or subconsciously, as in the case of people who seem to have an uncanny way of landing themselves in difficult situations? Or do you see all of these sufferings as permitted and sanctified through Christ? And what would be our proper response, then? To never seek to escape suffering, or to seek to escape it and mitigate it for others, to the glory of God? --Cheryl |
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64 | Seeking out suffering? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44885 | ||
Good point, Makarios. To give you an example, I married a man, years ago, who I knew was abusive. But I loved him and throughout our hellish marriage, I consoled myself that I was suffering for Christ. Many people would say that that suffering was avoidable, and that therefore my sufferings in that marriage cannot be placed under the sufferings of Christ. And in hindsight, aren't most sufferings avoidable, anyway? Major catastrophes are the exception, not the norm. Most of what we suffer, we bring upon ourselves through our choices, do we not? --Cheryl |
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65 | Which kinds of suffering? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44887 | ||
Thanks for your contribution, Searcher! So do you believe there is a difference between any of these types of suffering: 1) Fasting 2) Staying in an abusive marriage 3) Getting laid off due to industry downturns 4) Caring for an elderly parent instead of putting them in a nursing home 5) Getting hit by a hit-and-run drunk driver, and suffering a broken pelvis Which of these situations can legitimately be offered up in conjunction with the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross, and why? --Cheryl |
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66 | Suffering for Christ | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44893 | ||
That is the crux of the issue, Makarios: What does it mean to suffer "for Christ"? I cannot answer this. I am asking my Christian brothers and sisters for input. Thanks, Cheryl |
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67 | So, not ALL suffering is included? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 44960 | ||
So then, NOT all suffering can be applied to the verse in question, Col 1:24, in your opinion? --Cheryl |
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68 | What about abusive marriage? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45006 | ||
Hi Tim, Thanks for your input. But what about #2 (staying in an abusive marriage)? Couldn't that be done "consciously and willingly, seeking mortification of the flesh" as well? Not to mention that the Bible doesn't say anything about nursing homes, but it does tell us that the Lord "hates" divorce. --Cheryl |
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69 | What is a spiritual sacrifice? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45017 | ||
Hi Tim, and thanks for responding to this thread! I have a few quotes to add here: "It will be of great importance if you can leave the care of your affairs to, and spend the remainder of your life only in worshipping GOD. He requires no great matters of us; a little remembrance of Him from time to time, a little adoration: sometimes to pray for His grace, sometimes to offer Him your sufferings, and sometimes to return Him thanks for the favours He has given you, and still gives you, in the midst of your troubles, and to console yourself with Him the oftenest you can. Lift up your heart to Him, sometimes even at your meals, and when you are in company: the least little remembrance will always be acceptable to Him. You need not cry very loud; He is nearer to us than we are aware of." (Brother Lawrence, in The Practice of the Presence of God) "The suffering of man is also the suffering of God." (Paul Tournier) "Unearned suffering is redemptive." (Martin Luther King, Jr.) "We all know people who have been made much meaner and more irritable and more intolerable to live with by suffering; it is not right to say that all suffering perfects. It only perfects one type of person—the one who accepts the call of God in Christ Jesus." (Oswald Chambers) "I offer you, Lord, my thoughts: to be fixed on you; My words: to have you for their theme; My actions: to reflect my love for you; My sufferings: to be endured for your greater glory." (from the Universal Prayer, attributed to Pope Clement XI) Question: Are these thoughts and sentiments unscriptural? What does it mean to offer up a "spiritual sacrifice" (1 Pet 2:1)? --Cheryl |
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70 | The body, and the Head of the body | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45037 | ||
Hello, Makarios. You say that not all suffering is included in the afflictions of Christ. In Col 1:18, we read, "And He is the head of the body, the church...." A friend of mine broke her wrist recently, very badly. I went to visit her today, and she was telling me how she can't even do the simplest things for herself in that condition. Dressing herself, doing things about the house -- forget spending time on the computer! Clearly, her wrist injury has affected her whole life -- she can't say, "Well, it's just one wrist, I have another, so I just won't use that one for a while." Do you not believe that when one member of the body suffers, the whole body is afflicted? Whether I stub my toe or bite my lip, that pain signal is forwarded to my brain regardless, and for a moment, I cannot think of anything else. I am totally focused on the pain, and temporarily immobilized. Do you not believe Our Lord feels our pains and sufferings just as acutely? In Him, --Cheryl |
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71 | Differentiating between attacks | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45038 | ||
Hi meusing, You say, "An abusive relationship is an attack on us, not a cross to be born." But is not all persecution an attack, and still a cross to be borne? Do you draw a distinction between attacks stemming directly from our profession of faith, and all other attacks? --Cheryl |
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72 | Differentiating various sufferings | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45042 | ||
Thanks, meusing, for that wonderful quote! So, how do we distinguish between the sufferings that form part of that "light end" of the cross we carry, and other sufferings we might undergo that are completely unrelated to His sufferings, and carry no redemptive value? Or is there any difference? Peace, --Cheryl |
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73 | The body, and the Head of the body | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45061 | ||
I did read most of those references, Makarios. Which of them in particular do you feel bring to bear on this question? --Cheryl |
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74 | How do our sufferingss "fill up"... | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45062 | ||
Thank you for your input, Creed! But my question was directed more toward the verse in question, Col 1:24, and how our sufferings here would "fill up what is lacking in Christ's afflictions." I agree that we must prayerfully reflect in all sufferings. --Cheryl |
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75 | Suffering for Christ's sake | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45071 | ||
Thank you, Makarios, for your further thoughts. So, one could not legitimately suffer "for Christ's sake" the following ills: 1) A serious illness 2) Death of a family member 3) Natural disaster Since all of these cannot be suffered in holiness, must we then rant and rail against them? --Cheryl |
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76 | The lessons of suffering | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45113 | ||
Thanks for your reply, Creed. I agree that it is important to find the lesson in suffering, and that all suffering contains a hidden gift, a lesson, an inner transformation ("We also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope." (Rom 5:3-4)) But, to get back to the question, do you believe such things as I have listed can be suffered bravely "for Christ's sake," or that such sufferings are joined to His passion and sacrifice here on Earth? --Cheryl |
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77 | The lessons of suffering | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45208 | ||
I'm sorry if you find the thread overlong, Searcher, but I just don't think things are always so black-and-white. For example, I stayed with an abusive man for seven years because I thought it was my duty as a Christian, and that God would hold me to my vows no matter how bad the situation became. In your viewpoint, this wouldn't fall into the category of suffering "for His sake," but I disagree. My examples were intended to cover a broad range of circumstances, to get as many thoughts and ideas as possible on this subject. I have seen people counseled, in almost every type of difficulty imaginable, to "offer it up to the Lord," and to bear their trials patiently "for His sake." I was wondering whether this advice could really be applied so broadly, or whether there are situations that can't be offered up this way. --Cheryl |
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78 | Suffering for Christ's sake | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45209 | ||
I think we've gone far afield of my original question, here. To make sure I understand you correctly, are you saying Col 1:24 would not apply to all sufferings we experience? I believe we've come to that consensus with this thread -- now I'm just trying to define the kinds that WOULD apply, by using examples. --Cheryl |
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79 | No differences in suffering? | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45210 | ||
What do you mean by "no differences in suffering"? Are you saying that Col 1:24 would apply to ALL sufferings we experience? --Cheryl |
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80 | The lessons of suffering | Col 1:24 | LuckyCharm | 45307 | ||
Hi Creed, and thanks for your reply. I'm beginning to see that my Catholic upbringing has been showing through here in my questions, and that this concept is totally foreign to mainstream Protestantism. In case I have offended anyone here, I sincerely apologize. Peace, Cheryl |
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