Results 41 - 60 of 119
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Unanswered Bible Questions Author: Bill Mc Ordered by Date |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
41 | Thanks, but what about....? | Eph 2:5 | Bill Mc | 16862 | ||
Thanks, gentlemen. I love illustrations. Jesus used them all the time (parables). Of course, our illustrations never completely portray spiritual truth but they can be very helpful. But if salvation is a 3-part process, how can we preach and teach that people can be saved before they die? To use the plank illustration, what if, on the way to shore, the person being saved decides to bail out? Was he truly saved? Or what if, while in the vehicle of the church, he sins? The church is notorious for shooting their wounded and I have seen many leave the church as a result. Are these people still saved? If the culmination of our salvation is not experienced until we are 'home', then how can we assure anyone that they will make it? Wouldn't we do better to tell people that there is no way to be absolutely sure that they are saved until the process is complete? If this interpretation is correct, how can any of us be sure? Many people are probably saved from the plank. And many more are in church. But the only way to know if you are in the arms of God is to experience it and, by that time, it's too late. You may have been in the wrong church and this 'vehicle' has delivered you to the wrong shore! What do you think? |
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42 | Should we shake the dust from our feet? | Matt 10:14 | Bill Mc | 16859 | ||
Should we use this verse as justification to pull our missionaries out of countries like Afghanastan, Pakistan, or China where Christians are in danger of being killed or persecuted? There are many countries in the world that are hostile to Christians and the gospel message that salvation is found in Christ alone. Why do we maintain a missionary presence there if Jesus has told us that if we are not received, then we should leave and not come back? Also, would Matthew 7:6 apply? Jesus said not to throw your pearls before swine or they would turn and tear us to pieces? Is this what we are seeing with the terrorists' attacks on America? | ||||||
43 | Is salvation a process or onetime event? | Eph 2:5 | Bill Mc | 16821 | ||
Is salvation a process or a one-time event? I'm studying 'being saved' and some verses speak of it as a past event, like the one referenced above. Other verses seem to speak of being saved as a on-going process. And yet other verses seem to speak of being saved as a future event. Can anyone help me to understand what is meant by 'being saved'? Verses that support salvation as a past event: Eph 2:5,8; 2 Tim 1:9; Titus 3:5 Verses that support salvation as a current, on-going process: Rom 10:9; 1 Cor 1:18; Titus 2:11 Verses that support salvation as a future event: Rom 5:9,10 Thanks for your help, brothers and sisters. In Him, Bill Mc |
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44 | What is eternal life? | 1 John 5:13 | Bill Mc | 16627 | ||
What do you understand eternal life to be? What are the characteristics of it? When does it start? Can it be lost? If it can be lost, is it still, by definition, eternal life? All responses are welcome. I am interested to see (without argument from my particular point of view) what the forum believes about the eternal life that John says we, as believers, can know that we have. If you read this question, please respond with an answer. It would be interesting to observe what we, as a forum, think about eternal life. |
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45 | What is the breath of life? | Gen 5:3 | Bill Mc | 16614 | ||
Hi Lionstrong, Thanks for your reply. You stated: "The death fallen man experiences is the separation from God caused by sin and its curse, not the loss of the life God gave him." Then why did Jesus say that He came to bring us LIFE? Why does the NT make it clear that we are born DEAD in trespasses and sins? Why do these verses all say that we were made ALIVE in Christ? - See Rom 6:11; Rom 8:10; 1 Cor 15:22; Eph 2:5; Col 2:13 Lionstrong, you seem to imply that the death that God said would happen to Adam and Eve the day that they are from the forbidden tree was merely physical death. Yet they did not die immediately. Adam lived some 900 years after the fall. But God says, "The day you eat, you WILL die." If I understand your definition, the spirit of life (merely physical life, breath) is also possessed by the animal kingdom. But we know that they are not made in the image of God. "The life that man has is still spiritual, but it is no longer toward God." - Agreed. "By the breath of God, man was created as the image of God." True, but what is this breath of God. God is primarily spirit and as such, He had no human breath until Christ was born. A spirit, in the physilogical sense, does not breathe. So, if this 'breath of life' that God imparted to Adam is merely physical life, isn't that same thing evident in the animal world? In Christ, Bill Mc |
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46 | Forgiveness, is it conditional? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16568 | ||
Dear Tim, Please let me respond to your questions and, if you could add anything further, I would be interested and most appreciative. 1) Yes, I believe that forgiveness was obtained through the animal sacrifice in the OT. However, did God just issue a, for lack of a better word, 'blanket forgiveness' for everyone? Or did He actually look at individual's hearts and accept the offering based upon their attitudes? I am not honestly 100 percent sure here. I know that He told Saul, "Obedience is better than sacrifice." I.e. 'Don't just do what YOU want to do, and then come to Me with a sin offering and think that I HAVE to accept it.' I'm not sure where the scripture reference is (help me out here), but in one place God said something to the effect of, 'Stop your offerings, they are making Me sick because your hearts are far from Me.' Sorry that I can remember the reference or exact wording. So, I think a strong case can be made that, just like in salvation, the people needed to exercise faith in what God provided and God honored and responded to that faith. Is this way Christ told them to, basically, check their hearts before offering their sacrifice? Obviously, in the OT, the sacrificial system required that the offerings be made, but did everyone place their faith in them? Probably not. So was everyone forgiven just because they brought an offering? I don't think so. There was even a problem between Cain and Abel's offerings (I know, different type). But you know, Tim, I can't count the times in the past that I have gone to the altar (under the New Covenant obviously) to seek forgiveness when my own heart was not right? I just wanted forgiveness without being changed. God always sees my heart. And He KNOWS if I am sincere. As you know from my infamous 1 John 1:9 post, I no longer ask for forgiveness. It is not faith to ask for what God has already given me. But it is faith to thank Him for it and ask Him to show me where I am not walking in the Spirit, where I sin, where I am still walking in the flesh. So, yes I 'confess', I agree with God, but I don't ask for forgiveness. 2) I still don't feel that forgiveness is conditional. I do believe in concept of unlimited atonement (but I wouldn't use that word. Atonement is no where found in the Greek NT and I think that it reinforces that Christ's blood only 'covers' as opposed to takes away our sins). But you and I disagree as to what folks call 'eternal security' for reasons that we have already discussed. I see a way too many scriptures in the proper New Covenant (after Christ's death) that substantiate that we are baptized into Christ, united with Him, made a new creation, adopted by God, made alive with Him, born again, called children of God, citizens of heaven, made complete in Him, heirs of God, indwelt by His Spirit, partakers of the Divine nature, reconciled to God, redeemed, made righteous, called saints, saved, sealed, translated out of darkness into light, etc. (What a mouthful) If it is true that we can stop being all these things and remove ourselves from God and His forgiveness, I sure wish He would have prodded the NT writers to discuss it more fully and with greater clarity. If you can 'lose your salvation' or whatever label you want to stick on it, it seems like something with such dire consequences (ending up in Hell) would have been addressed much more than 2 or 3 verses of 'if you continue.' :) I'm not poking fun, but I do recall our prior interaction and, no, I still don't have an answer. Well, my fingers are getting tired... Thanks again, Tim. Grow in grace. In Him, Bill Mc |
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47 | Forgiveness - part 3 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16541 | ||
Forgiveness - part 3 of 3 (pant, pant) Now can Christ’s statement, “For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, but if you do not forgive others, then your heavenly Father will not forgive your transgression” be true after the cross? I submit that it cannot. See these verses: Col 2:13 - When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us ALL our transgressions. Eph 4:32 - Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also HAS FORGIVEN you. Col 3:13 - bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord FORGAVE you, so also should you. We now, as New Testament believers, forgive as, because, we HAVE BEEN forgiven. When were we forgiven ALL our sins? At the cross. Our forgiveness is part of our redemption – Eph 1:7; Col 1:14. It is no longer, I believe, conditional. The ultimate sin offering, the body of Christ has been made once-for-all – 1 Pet 3:18; Heb 9:26; Heb 10:12,14. Forgiveness of sins is secured. It is finished! So, what happens if a Christian does not forgive? According to scripture, we will give an account for what we do in our bodies – Rom 14:10-12. There is still rewards to be had. But I don’t believe that we will not be forgiven. There is too many verses that say otherwise. In closing, please see Heb 10:17,18. This is an important verse that describes one of the blessings that we, as well as future Israel, participate in under the New Covenant. God says here that He remembers our sins no more. Do we believe this verse? Isn’t Christ the mediator of this Covenant? Why does God remember our sins no more? Is it because He is having memory problems? Hardly. It is because of verse 18. It is because there IS forgiveness for ALL sins for ALL mankind for ALL time. This forgiveness exists. But it is only received upon placing one’s faith and trust in Jesus Christ’s sacrifice that was made 2000 years ago – Acts 10:43; Acts 26:18. Is there any other offering for sin? Not according to verse 18. Christ’s offering was COMPLETELY sufficient. We need to rest in that. We need to be thankful for that sacrifice and proclaim to the world, “To Him who loves us and released us from our sins BY HIS BLOOD – and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father – to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen. – Rev 1:5 - Bill Mc I hope this helps. I hope it answers your question. And, though you may not agree with me, that's OK, at least you know the reason for the hope within me. Blessings in Christ, Bill Mc |
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48 | Forgiveness - Part 2 of 3 | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16540 | ||
Forgiveness - Part 2 or 3 That being said, we must understand that when Christ was physically here on earth, the Old Covenant was still in full effect. Gal 4:4 states that Christ was born under law (Old Covenant law) and most of His teaching surrounded it. He Himself said that He did not come to abolish it, with His life, but to fulfill it. And having fulfilled the Old Covenant perfectly, He has brought in a New Covenant, a covenant of grace. Now, let’s take a look at the passage in question, Matthew 6:14: “For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.” I feel that the best explanation of this passage can be found in Matt 5:23, 24: "Therefore if you are presenting your offering at the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your offering there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and present your offering.” Here we see that Jesus says, ‘If you bring your offering to the altar (obviously a sin offering), and there remember that there’s a problem between you and your brother (another Jew), leave your offering, go make things right with your brother, then come back and offer your sacrifice.’ The Jews as a people, at this point in time, only knew of only one way to get forgiveness of sins – animal sacrifice. This system was still operational while Christ walked the earth. They understood that. It was the only system that they had every known for having their sins forgiven. And Christ never refuted it during His earthly life. Rather, He upheld the law. But He was also trying to get His listeners to look beyond the ceremony and tradition to see their hearts as God saw them. So He admonished them (my loose paraphrase), ‘If you’re coming to get forgiven by God, don’t just go through the motions. The law is summed up in loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself. So, yes, forgiveness is provided for you. But go beyond the requirements of the law and see that God cares about relationships. Try to heal those and then seek God’s provision of forgiveness and it will mean something to you.’ Christ condemned religious tradition for the sake of tradition alone. He wanted people to get past the rules to the relationships. So He says, ‘Forgive your brother, THEN come and offer your sacrifice. He NEVER said, ‘Don’t offer your sacrifice at the temple.’ Why not? Because that system, that pointed to His once-for-all sacrifice, had not YET been done away with. So why doesn’t He mention sacrifice in Matthew 6:14? I feel that it is because the Jews already knew what, under law, was required to provide forgiveness. If you had told a Jew at that time, “You sinned, you need forgiveness,” he would have tried to find an appropriate sacrifice and trotted off to the temple. But Christ was trying to show them that God looks on the heart. End of part 2 - see part 3 |
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49 | Tim, here is my explanation - 3 parts | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16539 | ||
Dear Tim, I'll post this as a question so that you'll be able to see it (and hopefully Steve also). Sorry it's taken so long to answer but it took me a while to get all my thoughts organized, type it out, and try to keep it as concise as possible. Please, please look up the scripture references. Don't believe it just because I say it (I'm probably not risking that danger here on the forum anyway). It's in 3 parts. Here goes: Let’s start by laying down a couple of foundational principles concerning the forgiveness of sins: 1) The wages of sin is death – Rom 6:23; Eze 18:4. Why? Because, in God’s economy, He has stipulated that disobeying Him results in forfeiture of life. This ‘life’ is primarily spiritual life (union with God), with physical death being a picture of spiritual death (separation from God). When Adam and Eve sinned, they spiritually died that very day although they physically died much later – Gen 2:17. This forfeiture of life is physically represented by the shedding of blood, where Lev 17:11 says that physical life dwells. Therefore, whenever anyone sins, they deserve to be spiritually separated from God (spiritually dead) with physical death as an illustration of that principle. But God, not wanting His creation to be or remain separate from Him, provided forgiveness for sins by the shedding of blood – Heb 9:22. This, I believe is the only means of providing forgiveness for sins. 2) Only God can forgive sins – Mark 2:7. Why? Because, being holy and righteous, sins are a personal offense against Him and His character. 3) God devised two ways of administering forgiveness of sins to mankind. In the Old Testament (Covenant), God, in His mercy, allowed animal blood to be shed in substitution for human blood. This mainly had to be done once a year by the high priest on the Day of Atonement. This animal blood covered ‘atoned for’ sins but did not take them away – Heb 10:11; Heb 10:4. Why? Because the animals had not sinned, man had. And although God personally took no pleasure in the sacrifices Heb 10:6,8, under law, He allowed them to be made. While the animal sacrifices covered sins, those sins were actually not paid for by human blood until Christ died at the cross. Heb 9:15 makes this clear. So… 4) Under the New Testament (Covenant), God, in amazing grace and mercy, accepted the sinless blood of His Son, Jesus Christ, as full payment for the sins of all mankind. This propitiation on Christ’s behalf ‘takes away’ the sins of all mankind (those born before the cross and those born after) permanently – Rom 3:25; Heb 2:17; Heb 9:26; 1 John 2:2; 1 John 4:10. 5) So, Christ death and shedding of blood on the cross becomes the focal point of the whole forgiveness issue. His precious blood took away all sins for all people for all time. It was an eternal act of God, being executed in time but not bound by it – Heb 4:3. His death is what ushered in the New Covenant of which He is the mediator. Heb 9:16,17 makes it clear that the New Covenant, Testament, Will (all the same word in Greek) did not go into effect until the death of the One who made it. Even in our society, your will, if you have one, does not go into effect until the day you die. Once you die, your will cannot be changed or revised and all wills prior to your last one are null and void. And, I believe, that the Old Will (Covenant) is no longer binding – Heb 8:13; Heb 10:9,10. It was only a shadow of the reality of Christ in us, the hope of glory – Heb 10:1. End of part 1 - See part 2 |
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50 | I do agree with most of your post, but.. | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16362 | ||
Dear schwartkm, I agree with most of your post. But I am not a Paulian. I am a Christian. The same Jesus that walked the face of the earth appeared to Paul and reveal the gospel to him. The same Spirit that indwelt Christ indwelt Paul to the extent that Paul said, "I no longer live, but Christ lives in me." And I am in no way trying to nullify all the teachings of Christ. But, as even you have stated, there is a progressive revelation in scripture. Why do you think Peter was so relunctant to hang out with the Gentiles. The disciples were amazed that the Gentiles could come to God through Christ. Please don't take this the wrong way, but I disagree with your definition of a Christian. Please hear me out on this. A Christian is not one who follows the teachings of Christ. It is much deeper than our futile attempts to mimic the Son of God. No one has EVER completely followed the teachings of Christ. Christ said, "Be perfect. How perfect? As perfect as your Father in heaven." Has anyone 'followed' this teaching? I think not. God's standard is perfection, our attempts to follow are insufficient. By that definition, Christians are those who follow the teachings of Christ, we are never completely Christians for none of us can do it perfectly. A Christian is one who has Christ living IN THEM - Romans 8:9-11. This is the essence of Christianity, Christ IN you, the hope of glory. Merely trying to follow Christ's teachings is not true Christianity because our 'trying' will always fall short. Being a Christian is a change of identity. It is anologous to a caterpillar changing into a butterfly. No matter how hard the caterpillar reads the flight manuals or follows the butterfly's teaching, he cannot do what the butterfly does (fly) because his nature is still a caterpillar. He can try to fly all he wants but he will always fall short. But, through a miracle, the caterpillar is changed into a butterfly. Only then can he do what butterflies are designed to do. Until we see that we are, indeed, new creations in Christ, we will be forever trying to follow the teachings of our Lord and failing. When we do come to realize that 'old things have passed away, behold, all things have become new', Christ Spirit inside us will fulfill God's own requirements through us. He who began a good work in you WILL BE faithful to complete it. It is God at work IN you to do His will. Please don't take this as a rebuke, schwartkm. It is not intended that way. It is intended as a clarification of the truth that you stated. In Christ, Bill Mc |
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51 | Why the forgiveness strawman? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16356 | ||
Dear schwartzkm, Yes this is a strawman. I am attempting to demonstrate that it is dangerous to take one scripture (in this case Matthew 6:14) and say that this applies to all people for all time, and that it is the heart of the forgiveness issue. And while I know that no Christian group teaches OT sacrifice, I feel that my argument is a valid one. I have not used the sabbath because the central issue here is the forgiveness of sins and I am trying to stay with that subject. Forgiveness of sins has always been based upon Hebrews 9:22, the shedding of blood. This forgiveness was credited in the OT by the atonement (covering) of the blood of animals (which pointed to Christ). The forgiveness of sins in the NT is secured by the shedding of our Lord's blood - nothing else. Steve's point is that, in his view, looking only at Matthew 6:14, forgiveness is based upon forgiving others. If this view is correct, then Christ's death and blood was unneccessary, indeed needless. All we would have to do to get forgiveness of our sins from God is to forgive our fellow man for their sins and this act alone would make us right or wrong with a holy God. Does the rest of NT scripture substantiate this lop-sided view? In Christ, Bill Mc |
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52 | Does this passage mention Christ? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16354 | ||
Steve, If you then go to Christ, then two observations must be made: 1) You have violated this passage. This passage says nothing about 'going to Christ'. According to this passage, this is not an option. No mention of Christ is made here whatsoever. God says to bring a lamb or goat. Granted, you do have the option of bringing two turtledoves, two pigeons or a tenth of an ephah of fine flour. But this passage makes no mention of any other offering being acceptable. 2) You cannot go to Christ. Christ is physically seated at the right hand of God. How can you get there? And how would you get your lamb, goat or other offering there? If we go strictly by this passage, and throw out any future revelation of God's plan of grace and forgiveness, then you have violated this means of forgiveness, my friend. Can't you see how foolish it is to 'camp' on older revelation and not accept the newer? Matthew 6:14 is the same. You cannot say, 'If I don't forgive, then God won't forgive' and also say, 'God has forgiven all my sins.' They are mutually exclusive. In Him, Bill Mc |
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53 | Shouldn't we obey ALL God's Word? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16344 | ||
Steve, Lev 5:5 'So it shall be when he becomes guilty in one of these (sins), that he shall confess that in which he has sinned. Lev 5:6 'He shall also bring his guilt offering to the LORD for his sin which he has committed, a female from the flock, a lamb or a goat as a sin offering. So the priest shall make atonement on his behalf for his sin. Do you do this everytime you sin? Why not? According to your interpretation, THUS SAITH THE LORD, right? Isn't this in God's Holy Word? Do you have the right to cut this verse out of God's Word? Or are you going to twist it? Wasn't this a command to God's people? Aren't you one of God's people? Isn't God the same, yesterday, today, and forever? Doesn't His Word stand forever? THOU SHALT DO IT! To quote a forum authority on the proper interpretation of God's Word, "You may choose to ignore this passage, or think it does not fit with the rest of the Bible. But, I think you need to accept it and obey it." Wouldn't you agree with him? |
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54 | How does Matt 6:14 look in the NT? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16308 | ||
How does Matthew 6:14 look in the New Covenant? Steve, I am not saying that Christians shouldn't or don't forgive. They should and do. What I am saying is that our motivation to forgive changes. The Spirit of God goes so much farther than rules ever could. How so? If we, as believers, only go by the letter of the law on this verse, many will forgive not because it is the Christ-like thing to do, but because they are afraid that God won't forgive them. It's like if you wronged me, I would then think, "Gee, I HAVE TO forgive Steve because, boy, if I don't, then God won't forgive me." So I forgive you (or at least say I do) purely out of selfish motive. I am worried, not about our relationship as brothers in Christ, but about my status before God. God has something better. Here it is: Eph 4:32 Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also HAS FORGIVEN you. Col 3:13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord FORGAVE you, so also should you. If you've wronged me, I can say, "You know what? God, in His grace, because of the blood of Jesus Christ, has forgiven Steve EVERY sin he has ever or will ever commit. God has accepted Steve as His child. And God has done the same for me. If the Lord forgave me, and forgave Steve, then who am I to hold a grudge. Am I greater than God's grace? Steve and I are brothers in Christ. That is a fact. So we need to act like brothers. Steve, you've wronged me but I care about our relationship so much that there must be a way to work this out." See where my motivation is now? Is it on myself? Or is it on Christ and what He has done? (He forgave us both and He has made us brothers in the same family) When I understand what Christ has truly done and how much I have been forgiven, then I will be prone to forgive BECAUSE I have been forgiven, not to OBTAIN it. Do you understand what I am saying here? In Christ, Bill Mc |
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55 | Steve, are these verses in your Bible? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16272 | ||
Dear Steve, Jesus Christ provided forgiveness for everyone, before the cross and after the cross, AT THE CROSS. You write, "We need to forgive them as this verse says. Verse 15 gives the result. If we don't forgive, it will be very hard on us." But Jesus said, after He said the above statement, in Luke 23:34 - "Father, forgive them, because they don't know what they are doing." HOWEVER, that forgiveness is only received upon placing one's faith in Christ. Once that is done, no more forgiveness is necessary or provided for the believer. Forgiveness is part of redemption. Proof? Eph 1:7 In Him we HAVE redemption through His blood, the FORGIVENESS of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace. Col 1:14 in whom we HAVE redemption, the FORGIVENESS of sins. Col 2:13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having FORGIVEN us ALL our transgressions. Eph 4:32 Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also HAS FORGIVEN you. Col 3:13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord FORGAVE you, so also should you. 1 John 2:12 I am writing to you, little children, because your sins HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN you for His name's sake. Acts 26:18 to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, that they may RECEIVE FORGIVENESS of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.' (When is it received? When they turn to God.) Heb 9:26 Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to PUT AWAY SIN by the sacrifice of Himself. (Did He do this?) Heb 10:17 "AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE." I have to wonder, brother, are these verses in YOUR Bible? Or are the only verses you know that deal with forgiveness of sins Matthew 6:14 and 1 John 1:9? You seem stuck, stuck, stuck, like a broken phonograph on the forgiveness issue. That's too bad. The Jesus I know said that, "It is finished! Paid in full!" Is this the same one you know? I wonder, Steve, in your theology, did the blood that Christ shed on the cross for the forgiveness of sins (Matt 26:28) do anything? John the Baptist said, "Behold, the Lamb of God who TAKES AWAY the sins of the world." Did He do that or does your Bible stop after the gospels? Even Rev 1:5 says, "To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood--" When and how were we released from our sins? By our death? Hardly. By the blood shed at His death - without the shedding of blood, there is no forgiveness of sins. In your copy of scripture, are these verses there? Or do you just chose to not believe them? In your view, what is the difference as far as the forgiveness of sins goes, between the blood of bulls and goats offered in the OT and the blood of your Savior offered in the NT? Just curious, Bill Mc |
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56 | Steve, are these verses in your Bible? | Matt 6:14 | Bill Mc | 16246 | ||
Dear Steve, Jesus Christ provided forgiveness for everyone, before the cross and after the cross, AT THE CROSS. You write, "We need to forgive them as this verse says. Verse 15 gives the result. If we don't forgive, it will be very hard on us." But Jesus said, after He said the above statement, in Luke 23:34 - "Father, forgive them, because they don't know what they are doing." HOWEVER, that forgiveness is only received upon placing one's faith in Christ. Once that is done, no more forgiveness is necessary or provided for the believer. Forgiveness is part of redemption. Proof? Eph 1:7 In Him we HAVE redemption through His blood, the FORGIVENESS of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace. Col 1:14 in whom we HAVE redemption, the FORGIVENESS of sins. Col 2:13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having FORGIVEN us ALL our transgressions. Eph 4:32 Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also HAS FORGIVEN you. Col 3:13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord FORGAVE you, so also should you. 1 John 2:12 I am writing to you, little children, because your sins HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN you for His name's sake. Acts 26:18 to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, that they may RECEIVE FORGIVENESS of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.' (When is it received? When they turn to God.) Heb 9:26 Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to PUT AWAY SIN by the sacrifice of Himself. (Did He do this?) Heb 10:17 "AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE." I have to wonder, brother, are these verses in YOUR Bible? Or are the only verses you know that deal with forgiveness of sins Matthew 6:14 and 1 John 1:9? You seem stuck, stuck, stuck, like a broken phonograph on the forgiveness issue. That's too bad. The Jesus I know said that, "It is finished! Paid in full!" Is this the same one you know? I wonder, Steve, in your theology, did the blood that Christ shed on the cross for the forgiveness of sins (Matt 26:28) do anything? John the Baptist said, "Behold, the Lamb of God who TAKES AWAY the sins of the world." Did He do that or does your Bible stop after the gospels? Even Rev 1:5 says, "To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood--" When and how were we released from our sins? By our death? Hardly. By the blood shed at His death - without the shedding of blood, there is no forgiveness of sins. In your copy of scripture, are these verses there? Or do you just chose to not believe them? In your view, what is the difference as far as the forgiveness of sins goes, between the blood of bulls and goats offered in the OT and the blood of your Savior offered in the NT? Just curious, Bill Mc |
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57 | So what is God's vs. Adam's image? | Gen 5:3 | Bill Mc | 16214 | ||
Hi Tim, Please permit me to jump in here: Therein lies my question. We know that Adam and Eve were created perfect. But scripture also makes it clear that they fell and passed sin and death to all their offspring (accept Christ). So, as you have so aptly asked, what is this image that Seth was created in? If it was truly God's image in the sense of moral purity, then it would seem to violate what we understand scripture to say about mankind being born in trespasses and sin. If it was simply an outward physical image, then it doesn't quite seem to fit with Adam being the outward image of God, for God is Spirit. If it was a personality image (mind, emotions, will - what one would call a soul), does this interpretation carry the most weight? Or should we not even interpret 'image' to be a reasonably exact representation but merely a 'form'? Thanks for your input. It is interesting that Moses did not write that Seth was born ALSO in God's image. In Christ, Bill Mc |
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58 | Is man still created in God's image? | Gen 5:3 | Bill Mc | 16189 | ||
Dear Charis, thanks for the clarification. To clarify my prior question to you, you had stated, 'This is the part of us that knows good and evil, and allows us know (be known by) the Lord and recognize His image in us, or conversely be led by our earthly body.' My implication was that I think that our spirits are what allows us to know God. I believe that scripture supports that many things of God are spiritually discerned. My soul (mind, will, and emotions - personality) cannot (to my utter frustration) understand the Trinity. But God has revealed it (through the Word written by, ultimately, the Holy Spirit) to be fact. It is the same way with my unregenerated spiritual death. My soul, apart from the revelation of God through His Word, would never have know that I was born spiritually dead. I would have thought, in my natural senses, sure, I'm alive. I could perceive myself and others (soul perception, soulishly alive) but I have no perception of God other than what my soul discerns from nature. I.e. I can tell from nature that God exists by I have very little information as to what He is really like. Hence the Law reflected His character in the OT (and ours) and Jesus Christ is the true, exact representation of God's nature in the NT. Well, I've probably taken this further than I initially wanted to and I have maybe confussed you (and myself). But, what I was trying to find out is this: Many co-workers are saying, "Now, Bill, you claim to be a Christian. Christians are against the death penalty and men are created in the image of God. So if you want these terrorists punished by death, than you will be killing what God created, right?" This was the point of my initial question. Are we STILL being created in the image of God? Thanks for your input and Christ-like spirit, Bill Mc |
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59 | Sorry about the digression. | Gen 5:3 | Bill Mc | 16185 | ||
Hi Sir Pent, Yes, this thread is supposed to be about man being created in the image of God. I had posted it because the subject came up that all men were created in God's image. And I was asked what right we had to kill something in God's image. My premise is that I don't believe that men are still created in God's image. I think man forfeited that specific attribute when Adam sinned. I DON'T feel that, if it's true that unregenrated man is no longer 'in God's image', that AUTOMATICALLY gives us a right to kill mankind. I think there are other scriptures that substantiate capital punishment. But ALL life ultimately proceeds from God. God is life. I believe that He has created three 'levels' (for lack of a better word) of life: 1) Physiological Life (purely physical life - plants) 2) Soul Life(mind, will, emotions - animals) and 3) Spiritually Life (the highest form of life that is eternal by which we relate to God and He relates to us). So my question was whether God is still 'creating man in His own image' every time someone is born. Unfortunately, I have never resolved exactly what 'made in His image' means. Any thoughts? In Him, Bill MC |
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60 | Is this any clearer? Einee-Minee... | Gen 5:3 | Bill Mc | 16158 | ||
charis, thanks for the clarification. To clarify my prior question to you, you had stated, 'This is the part of us that knows good and evil, and allows us know (be known by) the Lord and recognize His image in us, or conversely be led by our earthly body.' My question was that I think that our spirits are what allows us to know God. I believe that scripture supports that many things of God are spiritually discerned. My soul (mind, will, and emotions - personality) cannot (to my utter frustration) understand the Trinity. But God has revealed it (through the Word written by, ultimately, the Holy Spirit) to be fact. It is the same way with my unregenerated spiritual death. My soul, apart from the revelation of God through His Word, would never have know that I was born spiritually dead. I would have thought, in my natural senses, sure, I'm alive. I could perceive myself and others (soul perception, soulishly alive) but I have no perception of God other than what my soul discerns from nature. I.e. I can tell from nature that God exists by I have very little information as to what He is really like. Hence the Law reflected His character in the OT (and ours) and Jesus Christ is the true, exact representation of God's nature in the NT. Well, I've probably taken this further than I initially wanted to and I have maybe confussed you (and myself). But, what I was trying to find out is this: Many co-workers are saying, "Now, Bill, you claim to be a Christian. Christians are against the death penalty (I am not against it, personally I beleive the law is made for the ungodly) and men are created in the image of God. So if you want these terrorists punished by death, than you will be killing what God created, right?" This was the point of my initial question. Are we STILL being created in the image of God? Thanks for your input and Christ-like spirit, Bill Mc |
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