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Results from: Notes Author: trigger Ordered by Date |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 169055 | ||
Dear Doc. Just sending a quick note to thank you for your time and effort in responding to my email. I did find one part of your email that addressed my particular question and also found that the website you suggested helped some. I am continuing to pursue my study of this subject for the many questions that remain unanswered. I have been reading the book "Slaves, Women and Homosexuals," and find that the author's term, "redemptive spirit" hermenuetic, is sometimes referred to as progressive revelation, the term you use, so maybe you are saying the same thing? As I read the book it also reminds me of things that "Just Read Mark" has posted. I only have time on weekends to come to this site, and won't be able to access it next weekend. I hope to finish the book and get back to you with what I find. Thanks again for all of your help! -Trigger |
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2 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 168406 | ||
Dear Doc. I just read your personal profile and also the website you suggested for those who wanted to learn what it meant to follow Christ. The website accuratly expresses my belief, also, and I look forward to meeting you in heaven. :) In the meantime...I've also looked over some of your posts. Whew! I would love to discuss some of the problems I'm having, and maybe get some of my questions answered, but the terms you use reflect an education on these matters that I do not possess. I guarantee you that I cannot articulate my confusion regarding O.T. laws and ordinances as well as you can articulate things, nonetheless, I would LOVE to get your opinion on some of these things, please. I too believe that the cannon of scripture is closed. (Good thing. Because right now, I've got enough problems with what we already have! :) But, I'm sure you can help. You say that the cannon of scripture is closed (I agree), and that it was a progressive revelation (I agree). I did NOT mean to imply that the "meaning" of scripture changes depending on the dispensation you live in. Sin (going my own way) is sin no matter which dispensation you live in. But what constitutes sin in one dispensation, does not necessarily constitute sin in another. This is NOT an argument against the inspiration of scripture. I simply WISH I had the answer, for instance, for why God told the Israelites that eating fish without scales or fins was an abomination (Lev. 11:10), the same as the sin of homosexuality or the sin of witchcraft. Today, in our culture, eating shellfish is not a sin. Why then and not now? If you haven't looked at the website in my very first post, please do so. I totally understand the fact that Jesus Christ is our substitute, PRAISE GOD!, so I'm not looking for an explanation on why the animal sacrifices are no longer necessary. But what really confuses me even more than the shellfish issue or the hair trimming around the temples (Lev. 19:27), is the revelation given to Moses about treatment of slaves. I work with African American people who I dearly love who are not believers. The Bible is a frequent subject of conversation. Because of their history, what would you say to them when they see God's rules regarding slaves and condoning the treatment of slaves as "less than" and as "property." (Ex. 21:18-21, 28-32) A man can beat his slave, and as long as the slave doesn't die, than there is no consequence, because the slave is his property. Another one is Lev. 18:18 where it says "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as theyself," but then is immediately followed with scripture (Lev. 18:20) that says that if a man lies with a slave woman who is betrothed to someone else, the slave woman will get scourged, she will not die, because she was not free (implied, she did not have a choice in the matter), but the man shall only bring an offering and then he shall be forgiven. (Lev. 19:20) This is different treatment than with the sexual violation of a free woman (Duet. 22:25-27). Also, the value of a slave's life was less than the value of a free person's life. See Ex. 21-:28-32. I desperately wish I had an answer. If I am not interpreting scripture correctly, I trust you will tell me. More importantly, what would you tell them? Because this subject has and will continue to come up, and I don't have an answer. I look forward to your help with this. Thank you and God Bless You. - Trigger |
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3 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 168392 | ||
Doc, I think the author of the book I mentioned uses the word "redemptive" differently than you are using it, but appropriately when read in its context. I was borrowing from his thought, so maybe the meaning of "redemptive" in my communication was unclear because I failed to convey the entire context of his thought. My only "redemption" is through Jesus Christ, My Lord and Savior, and His complete atonement for my sins through His death on the cross. 1. So, No to your first question. 2. As to your second question, holiness is not a relative thing, today, in this culture. But I think it may be considered "relative to the culture" we live in. For example, David had many wives, yet God never addressed that, yet he was still called "a man after God's own heart." I think if you had many wives today, you would not be called "a man after God's own heart." 3. I agree with your statement that the Bible is about the work of God redeeming a people for His own. 4. Sin is sin, yes, although what constitutes sin has sometimes changed depending on the dispensation you are in. (For more on this, see the website referred to in my original question.) God Bless! -Trigger |
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4 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 168388 | ||
JRM, I'm been gone awhile, but I'm back. I just re-read your answer again (and the others' replies). I am continuing to pursue answers to my original question. Obviously, we're all in different places, with different issues being more important to us at different times, but thanks be to God, who meets us where we are, and leads us to answers that allow us to move on, in peace, towards spiritual maturity. Again, I found your words edifying. Yes, I agree, that "God moved people within their historical context, not to an ideal position (timeless), but to an improved position from where they were" in their culture. As I think about the example of slavery--I see that God made rules for the treatment of slaves, rather than abolishing slavery itself. Interesting. Yet, today, we do not believe God wants us to have slaves, even though slaves/servants were also "allowed" in the New Testament. Paul asks Philemon to take back his servant, Onesimus, and to accept him as a brother in the faith. (Philemon 1:16) So, there is a progression towards a more redemptive culture here. Yet, Paul requests this, rather than commands this, and leaves it to Philemon as to what he does in the end. I believe in the inspiration and inerrancy of scripture, but I also believe that following the spirit of the law, "love others as I have loved you," rather than the letter of the law, in these cases, is what we are called to do. (Romans 7:6, 2 Cor. 3:6) I've just purchased a book entitled, "Slaves, Women, and Homosexuals," by William J. Webb. The book is a challenging read so far, and the author helps to shed some light on the movement towards a more redemptive culture in the areas of slavery and women. However, he is explains why this progression does not apply when it comes to the sin of homosexuality. I'm hoping it will shed some light on some of the O.T. laws in light of these cultural changes. I think you'd enjoy it also. Take care. - Trigger |
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5 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 168109 | ||
JRM, Thank you very much for your beautiful response. I've read it twice now. I really appreciate the way you think, and I'm thinking I could learn more from you. I have had some of the same thoughts, for instance on the subject of slavery, that you mention in your response. I would love to talk more with you, but I won't be able to get back to you again until next weekend. I enjoyed reading your comments very much. It edified me, and brought peace to my soul. I especially was glad to read that your relationship with Christ has not suffered among the apparent contradictions you have stumbled across in God's Word. Thank you for taking the time to share your heart! God Bless You! | ||||||
6 | Inspired or not? | OT general | trigger | 168057 | ||
Sure, Brad, I can elaborate and, in fact, I just did. I wrote several paragraphs and then decided against "posting" it. So, I cut and paste it into a Word document, and I'll send it to your private email address. I guess I have a problem with "posting" some of my experiences. I am bothered as to whether my words will affect newer, younger Christians in a negative way. | ||||||
7 | Cannot mix different cloths in O.T.? | OT general | trigger | 168036 | ||
Hello JRM. Thank you so much for the time you invested to answer my question. I just sent a long follow up to your answer, with three questions, but I can't find anywhere. I am confused by this website. I don't know how to find "threads" in case it went there, or find things submitted on the Old Testament. Did you get my three question follow up? I didn't save a copy. | ||||||