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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Once saved are you going to heaven? | Bible general Archive 1 | gracefull | 86875 | ||
Hello John, I do not desire to get into this discussion of predestination, but would like to question your use of this one scripture reference to prove it. In context Jesus is speaking to His disciples concerning the one who will betray Him. As the disciples ask 'Is it I?' Jesus responds... John 13:18 18 but it is that the Scripture may be fulfilled, 'HE WHO EATS MY BREAD HAS LIFTED UP HIS HEEL AGAINST ME.' There is no reason to asume this scripture is speaking generally about all 'chosen' but rather to this specific few "I do not speak of all of YOU (present is understood). I know the ones I have chosen;" The fact that He specifically singled out and chose these disciples is not in question. I do not believe this verse in context is an asset to your case. God bless |
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2 | Once saved are you going to heaven? | Bible general Archive 1 | John Reformed | 86902 | ||
Gracefull, John 13:18 "I do not speak of all of you. I know the ones I have chosen; but it is that the Scripture may be fulfilled, 'HE WHO EATS MY BREAD HAS LIFTED UP HIS HEEL AGAINST ME.' The crucial point is that they did not choose Him first. This verse demonstrates the soveriegnty of God to choose whom He will and for His good pleasure. In this case election unto salvation is not the topic. Nevertheless it is not without value in demonstrating God's omnipotent power. I do not buy the concept of a God who has made salvation only mere possibility. If that were the case then it would have been possible that Christ would have suffered and died in vain! But what does Jesus say? John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day. I'm sorry if you thought my choice of Scripture was questionable. I must admit I was pressed for time this a.m., and that is why I suggested that Rob search the Scripture himself (really the best way anyway). Grace and Peace, John Reformed |
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3 | Once saved are you going to heaven? | Bible general Archive 1 | gracefull | 86975 | ||
"The crucial point is that they did not choose Him first. This verse demonstrates the soveriegnty of God to choose whom He will and for His good pleasure. In this case election unto salvation is not the topic. Nevertheless it is not without value in demonstrating God's omnipotent power." This is certainly true. He 'chose' men and woment through out the scriptures, such as Esther. Esther 4:14For if thou altogether holdest thy peace at this time, then shall there enlargement and deliverance arise to the Jews from another place; but thou and thy father's house shall be destroyed: and who knoweth whether thou art come to the kingdom for such a time as this? "But what does Jesus say? John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day." 41 (15) Therefore the Jews were grumbling about Him, because He said, "I am the bread that (16) came down out of heaven." 42 They were saying, "Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How does He now say, 'I have come down out of heaven'?" 43 Jesus answered and said to them, "Do not grumble among yourselves. 44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day. 45 "It is written in the prophets, ' AND THEY SHALL ALL BE TAUGHT OF GOD.' Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me. 'Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me.'Something to ponder...Does the Holy Spirit draw only certain ones or does He draw and certain ones hear? "I'm sorry if you thought my choice of Scripture was questionable. I must admit I was pressed for time this a.m., and that is why I suggested that Rob search the Scripture himself (really the best way anyway)." We all do this from time to time. Ocasionally our choice needs to be questioned because we often 'group scriptures with different messages' and convey a conclusion the scripture does not convey. As a teacher, this is always something I try to watch for. New believers will here a conclusion and lock onto the scripture without actually studying it through to it's conclusion. Thank you John for responding and clarifying why you chose this scripture. I thought that was your point, but for the sake of the 'seeker' I felt that this one needed a little commentary. "and that is why I suggested that Rob search the Scripture himself (really the best way anyway)." I agree...probably everything that could be said has been said on this subject!!!! God bless! |
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