Results 1 - 2 of 2
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Will we be here once anti-Christ appears | 1 John 2:18 | Emmaus | 86264 | ||
Scribe, I must give you credit for not remaining vague in time frames and not buying into the Constantine myth of apostasy. If your analysis is correct, then Christ's promise that the He would be with the Church always and that the Holy Spirit would lead the Church to all truth was patently false. It would also assume that the St. Paul's admonitions to pass on what he had taught both in writing and by word of mouth to carefully chosen men by the laying on of hands was bad advice that bore bad fruit. Even Ignatius was only two men removed from St. Peter as bishop of Antioch. Is it likely such a basic teaching as the day of worship of the meaning of the Lord's Day would be so quickly lost and without a dispute by the faithful who had for three generations been living the christian way? And even the New Testament itself makes it clear that the various local churches were in rather close communication with one another, as evidenced by Acts and the Epistles of St. Paul. I believe it is the writings of the Fathers that gives us the context necessary to understand how the early Church understood certain passages of Scripture, in particular Revelation 1:10, which, the majority opinion dates to about 95 A.D. only 5 to 15 years prior to the date you give for Ignatius. I also think your translation of Rev 1:10 is very interesting and a good example of polyvalent meanings that can be taken in interpreting the Scripture on more than one level. Here are a few passages on this subject of Sunday worship. "The Didache "But every Lord’s day . . . gather yourselves together and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned" (Didache 14 [A.D. 70]). The Letter of Barnabas "We keep the eighth day [Sunday] with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead" (Letter of Barnabas 15:6–8 [A.D. 74]). Ignatius of Antioch "[T]hose who were brought up in the ancient order of things [i.e. Jews] have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s day, on which also our life has sprung up again by him and by his death" (Letter to the Magnesians 8 [A.D. 110]). Justin Martyr "[W]e too would observe the fleshly circumcision, and the Sabbaths, and in short all the feasts, if we did not know for what reason they were enjoined [on] you—namely, on account of your transgressions and the hardness of your heart. . . . [H]ow is it, Trypho, that we would not observe those rites which do not harm us—I speak of fleshly circumcision and Sabbaths and feasts? . . . God enjoined you to keep the Sabbath, and imposed on you other precepts for a sign, as I have already said, on account of your unrighteousness and that of your fathers . . ." (Dialogue with Trypho the Jew 18, 21 [A.D. 155]). "But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead" (First Apology 67 [A.D. 155]). Tertullian "[L]et him who contends that the Sabbath is still to be observed as a balm of salvation, and circumcision on the eighth day . . . teach us that, for the time past, righteous men kept the Sabbath or practiced circumcision, and were thus rendered ‘friends of God.’ For if circumcision purges a man, since God made Adam uncircumcised, why did he not circumcise him, even after his sinning, if circumcision purges? . . . Therefore, since God originated Adam uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, consequently his offspring also, Abel, offering him sacrifices, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, was by him [God] commended [Gen. 4:1–7, Heb. 11:4]. . . . Noah also, uncircumcised—yes, and unobservant of the Sabbath—God freed from the deluge. For Enoch too, most righteous man, uncircumcised and unobservant of the Sabbath, he translated from this world, who did not first taste death in order that, being a candidate for eternal life, he might show us that we also may, without the burden of the law of Moses, please God" (An Answer to the Jews 2 [A.D. 203]). The Didascalia "The apostles further appointed: On the first day of the week let there be service, and the reading of the holy scriptures, and the oblation, because on the first day of the week our Lord rose from the place of the dead, and on the first day of the week he arose upon the world, and on the first day of the week he ascended up to heaven, and on the first day of the week he will appear at last with the angels of heaven" (Didascalia 2 [A.D. 225]). excerpts from a full article on the subject at: http://www.catholic.com/library/Sabbath_or_Sunday.asp Emmaus |
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2 | Will we be here once anti-Christ appears | 1 John 2:18 | Scribe | 86275 | ||
(Part 3 of 3) Considering the Bible as our source and looking no further Seiss has presented a stronger argument for interpreting it as the Day of the Lord. If we have to look outside of the Bible to get one shred of evidence that it is Sunday, so that the only references to The Lord’s Day as Sunday is outside of the Bible then we are on questionable ground. Of course if you take the stand that Early Writers and the Catholic Church is authority enough for your faith then you are comfortable with that. I have to have God’s Word on every article of my faith. So far .. (and I am open ).. Seiss has a stronger biblical basis than those that present their argument for Rev 1:10 applying to Sunday. Now if it were meant here (Rev 1:10) that it meant Sunday, I would only get a lesson that on Sunday John must have decided to pray more than on other days, and this may have been the case with the majority of saints even in the very first generation, but I don’t think it was the case with the apostles, I think they were diligently giving themselves to prayer on all days of the week. This idea that it is Sunday would suggest a more vigorous spiritual activity on John’s part than on other days and as a result he has entered into a “trance” or been taken up (whether in the body or out of the body, we do not know). So it would teach us, that no matter what condition you find yourself, on Sunday you should turn toward God in fervent prayer. I am sure that this has been preached, but I am not so sure that is the correct message of this verse. However if it means that John was translated into the Day of the Lord by the Spirit we then see a foundational truth that enables us to correctly interpret the whole vision to come and all that is written in the book. This seems to make better sense but I am not going to contend for it as the only possible explanation. Let’s just say at this time, taking into account both arguments, I lean toward, The Day of the Lord. May God bless you as you mine the depths of His eternal Word. |
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