Results 1 - 5 of 5
|
|
|||||
Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Pt.1 Female Overseer | 1 Tim 2:12 | TheCurtMan | 86221 | ||
Part 1 Around the 4th of June, a question was posted, "Should a woman teach a man??" Or something like that. So I put my two cents in on that one. I received a reply to that question in the affirmative. I'd like to address it. It started with this question, "Is there a scripture that specifically says that a woman can not be a Pastor??" I would have to say that according to the principles in I Timothy, chp.3, verses 1-7, YES!! Take the opportunity to do a Word Study on the title 'Bishop' in v.2. What you'll discover is that Bishop can also be translated as Elder; Shepherd; Overseer; and even Pastor. The Pastor is the Overseer of the congregation; He's the Shepherd of that particular flock. Now the qualifications for this position is listed within these verses. Now v.1 starts out by saying, "If a MAN desires the position of a Bishop, HE desires a good work." Notice the word MAN, not woman. There are places in the scriptures where the word Man is used as a universal term meaning both men and women. This IS NOT one of those occasions, you can tell by the context. V.2, A Bishop then must be...the husband of one wife. My first question to you is, "How can a woman be the husband of one wife and still remain in God's Perfect Will??" V.4, One who rules HIS house well. According to the culture of that day, it was the MAN who ruled the household; not the woman. Unfortunately, the qualifications of an Overseer do not fit a woman. Also, take a look at I Tim. 2:12, "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man..." Now this verse has really been taken outta context by many men, but IN context, Paul is referring to a church gathering. This verse can also be used in the affirmative to answer your question. However, my question to you is this, "How can a Female Overseer be an Overseer and not teach nor have authority over her male congregation??" You can't see how these verse tend to come together on this issue?? And how about I Corinthians 14:34-35, "Let your women keep silent in the church, for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are COMMANDED to be under OBEDIENCE, as also saith the law. And if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home; for it is a shame for a women to speak in the church." The obvious question would be, "How can a Female Overseer be silent within her own congregation??" Better still, "How can a Female Overseer BE a Female Overseer and still remain obedient to God??" You stated that you wanted to adhere to the correct interpretation of scripture, but in order to do this you must study scripture. Do Word Studies; Get an understanding how the Greeks used certain words; Get an understanding of their culture; and above everything else, PRAY for Understanding. The Holy Spirit isn't going to tell you one thing about scripture, and tell someone else the complete opposite. He doesn't work that way. My next couple of questions involves our Lord and Savior... |
||||||
2 | Pt.1 Female Overseer | 1 Tim 2:12 | Scribe | 86222 | ||
How far do you go with this. I mean, I agree that a man should be a pastor. But what about people who work for women bosses? Are these men messed up? Should they be seeking a different job? What about women in the church who work and are in management positions over men. Are they out of the will of God? Does this rule that women should not be in authority over men only apply to church? If we believe that the correct interpretation of these passages is that women should never be in a position of authority over a man, then are we going to live like we believe that or are we going to play games with it, saying a woman cannot teach in our church and yet go to work on Monday and say yes maam to our boss? What kind of truthfulness is that? We either believe this is the interpretation or we are not sure. I think most people who are so adament about not believing a woman can pastor are compromisers becuase they will work for women and submit to women on their jobs. Where do we get the authority to say that it is ok to submit to a woman on your job and not in the church? Either stand by your principles or admit your not clear about this authority and women thing. And if you are not clear about it, then maybe we are messing up the meaning of these passages. If there is room to submit to a female boss at work then we are seeing some kind of "acception" to the rule. If we have confidence we are in the will of God while living with this "acception" to the rule, then we have moved into the realm of spiritual application to New Testament rules or given ourselves liberty to apply the spirit of the rule rather than the letter of the law. And what then is the meaning of the spirit of the rule here, if it is about authority then we have "bent" the rule at work by submitting to women bosses, if we say the rule cannot be bent or we are in violation to the word, then we should be true to our convictions and quit our jobs and not accept another that places us under the authority of women. If we believe this is wrong and yet we continue under the authority of women, we sin. Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin. I would not sit under a woman pastor. I do not believe it is correct to have women pastors but I do think that it is becuae of a hard fast rule about authority, I believe I can have a woman at work in authority over me, but I (would never marry such a woman :) ) Have you ever considered that Paul was speaking about spiritual things. That in the church it is Love that matters and it would be a hinderance to the spreading of the Gospel in that day when women were not allowed to lead in Jewish religion to allow them to lead in the church, it would make it unnecessarily hard for men to hear or even listen to the message. It would be better for if a woman who was gifted and called to ministry of the word to submit to men so that the message could be recieved, so we have Pricilla and Aquila and Pricilla seems to be the main teacher and even teaches a man Appollos but she is always named with her husband Aquilla which shows a submissive heart and therefore men like Apollos are well able to recieve her teachings becuase she is not usurping authority over a man. By the way let us always focus on every word of the text, the words are must not usurp authority over a man which speaks of a brash sort of pushing oneself forward in a fleshly authority. But having a gift to minister does not automatically put the woman in violation of the authority issue. As a matter of fact there are more instances of women usurping authority over men is brash and fleshly way at your work than in the church. Often in the church you have a "submitted" woman getting grief for daring to teach the Bible, and yet the women who are USURPING authority over men at work are left alone. Just a few thoughts to help kick off the second round of the debate. :) |
||||||
3 | Pt.1 Female Overseer | 1 Tim 2:12 | TheCurtMan | 86231 | ||
Actually I think that if there are issues with the Word of God, then it should be taken up the The Author, don't you think?? Or at least His Holy Spirit. The bible doesn't mention a womans' authority over a man in the work force, just in the household and in the House of the Lord?? Maybe you should ask The Author why He didn't elaborate a little about the workforce. And please get back with me when you get your answer, because I really do need to know. |
||||||
4 | Pt.1 Female Overseer | 1 Tim 2:12 | Scribe | 86245 | ||
LOL. Well I am not concerned about it myself, I even listen to women teach the Word. I was just adding some good logic as to why we might be applying legalism to New Testament instructions and trying to put women back under the law, and that would be a very bad thing in the AUTHOR'S eyes wouldn't it? I think we have to be careful and make sure we are knowing the AUTHOR then we will interpret the Word according to the SPIRIT of the AUTHOR and not a legalistic interpretation He never intended. The more I look at this subject the more I see women as being quite oppressed by christian men and it was never meant to be that way. If there is one thing Jesus brought that was liberty for all man and woman. I am leaning toward the USURP being key to understanding this. Also I lean toward the idea of women teaching in the church as not prohibited by this statement but that of teaching men as in a fleshly way, teaching them to do what the woman wants. Kind of like what wives have a problem with. LOL. If he had said I suffer a woman not to teach the word in the church I could see the point, but it says I suffer not a woman to teach or usurp authority over the man which sounds more like what I witness often among couples who don't believe in women teaching in the church. In other words, they don't believe in women teaching in the church and yet the woman keeps teaching and usurping authority over the man by nagging and scolding him. | ||||||
5 | Pt.1 Female Overseer | 1 Tim 2:12 | TheCurtMan | 86341 | ||
First of all I think it is unbiblical to take a 'conditional biblical principle and aply it across the board. One can not say that a woman can never have authority over a man, because like I said, our Father never elaborated on this in the areana of the work field, therefore one can not say it aplies. He was specific in the areana of the household, and Sunday Morning Service. Also, there is a difference between being a Pastor, and being a Teacher, and scripture tells women that they should teach. It implies that they should not teach a man is all. Have you notice that young women today don't know how to be a young woman?? Why is that?? Because they haven't been taught properly that's why. Man isn't the only one in the world that needs to be taught. Teaching for the Woman of God is a commandment. So why get upset over what we can't do and focus on what truely needs to be done. Christians all over this world is falling short of our Heavenly Father's Expectations because our focus is not where it should be, and I'm no exception |
||||||