Results 1 - 8 of 8
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 243256 | ||
"We believe that the Baptists are the original Christians. We did not commence our existence at the reformation, we were reformers before Luther and Calvin were born; we never came from the Church of Rome, for we were never in it, but we have an unbroken line up to the apostles themselves. We have always existed from the days of Christ, and our principles, sometimes veiled and forgotten, like a river which may travel under ground for a little season, have always had honest and holy adherents. Persecuted alike by Romanists and Protestants of almost every sect, yet there has never existed a Government holding Baptist principles which persecuted others; nor, I believe, any body of Baptists ever held it to be right to put the consciences of others under the control of man. We have ever been ready to suffer, as our martyrologies will prove, but we are not ready to accept any help from the State, to prostitute the purity of the Bride of Christ to any alliance with Government, and we will never make the Church, although the Queen, the despot over the consciences of men." --Charles H. Spurgeon (1834-1892) * *Not sure I entirely agree, but the general sense presents a consensus among Baptists (Take it with a grain of salt). On the other hand, Spurgeon would be someone with whom you could have far greater confidence in than with me! |
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2 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | EdB | 243260 | ||
I think every denomination believes and teaches that. History is easy to manipulate if you snip here add there and ignore this and emphasize that. |
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3 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 243264 | ||
Hi, Ed... I entirely concur. You have made a very profound and deeply significant statement. We Reformed Baptists receive Spurgeon as one of our own, but the reality is that he was not a member of a denomination, nor even an association -- that is common among many Baptists even today. Nonetheless, Spurgeon himself wrote of the danger of unity with those who deny the fundamentals truths of the Christian faith. I think you have declaimed Martin Luther, John Calvin, and Arthur W. Pink to the hall of villiany in which you now place Charles Spurgeon. May God show them mercy! We ought not be blind to the faults of church leaders in Lutheran, Presbyterian, and Baptist circles. In Scripture we have record of the moral failings of great men like Moses and David. Our Lord tells us, "You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they?" (Matthew 7:16) Yet Moses and David -- and need I list others? -- have their Godly witness born out in lives that showed a general bent toward righteousness. "For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned." (Matthew 12:37) You wrote, "History is easy to manipulate if you snip here add there and ignore this and emphasize that." In other words, those who manipulate the truths of the past are liars and deceivers. Though, I suspect there is a lot of ignorance -- as per Peter's description "unstable and unlearned." This is their fruit, plain for all to see. Thus, we can and ought to identify them (cf John 8:44; 1 Timothy 1:8-11; Revelation 21:8, 27, 22:15). False teaching ultimately becomes characterized by accompanying forms of immorality -- lying is only the beginning. Consequently, we must not be ingenuous -- thus joining their ranks! God forbid! -- by excluding anyone who fails the God given standard of the fruit they bear. Thus, as we examine the public records in just the last hundred years, there are people like Charles Fox Parham, A. A. Allen, Aimee S. McPhearson, Duncan Leighton, Billy James Hargis, Jim Bakker, Peter Popoff, Bob Jones, Mike Warnke, Earl Paulk, Clarence McClendon, Roberts Liardon, Douglas Goodman, Lonnie Frisbee, Paul Cain, Ted Haggard, Todd Bentley, Michael Guglielmucci, Eddie Long, Roy Clemments, Paul Barnes, Gilbert Deya, Paul Cain, Ralph Rutledge, etc. ... to name but name a few. Ultimately the ones justified will be mercifully vindicated by a Holy God while the unrighteous will receive His just wrath. "So the LORD cuts off head and tail from Israel, Both palm branch and bulrush in a single day. The head is the elder and honorable man, And the prophet who teaches falsehood is the tail. For those who guide this people are leading them astray; And those who are guided by them are brought to confusion." (Isaiah 9:14-16) If this is true in the days of Isaiah, how much more is it true in these days of the Kingdom of the Lord Jesus Christ? Thank you for these frequent reminders of the day in which we live. In Him, Doc |
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4 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | EdB | 243266 | ||
I don't think I declaimed anyone to the hall villainy, I just pointed out that they were mere mortal men like you and I. They did not speak nor did most of them claim to speak infalliblily they offered their opinion. Some were more qualified than others but what they said was no more than their opinion. Their fruit in many cases of the latter produced a church that is neither cold nor hot but rather lukewarm. They unleashed a tolerant but less holy church. Some would commit a dead unbaptized still born infant to hell for eternity but allow a practicing homosexual, divorced, transgender in pulpit to preach God's holy word. Man has many faults and following anyone man or any specific group of men other than Christ himself leads to destruction. Paul says if any comes teaching a different gospel they are false teachers. Many use the name of God in attempt to make their counterfeit look genuine. A perfect counterfeit twenty printed on a brick would instantly be seen as counterfeit, that same fake twenty printed on authentic paper would fool many. Same way the teaching of many they know if their message sounds like anything but from God it will not be received. So they carefully frame it as Gods speaking in attempt to profit from it. The names you mentioned are all known because of the size of the impact of their transgression. But I submit to that there are thousands that stand in pulpit yesterday around the world supposedly preaching under the anointing of God that are not even saved. They have no idea of salvation because they never experienced it. Even worst many live in open sin and their sins are winked at by the church and their denomination. Some even deny the Holy Spirit. How many more do they impact than all these you listed. |
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5 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 243270 | ||
Hi, Ed... I don't know. Sorry, I am not so much of an expert on other denominations, movements, and trends in religious circles. What impact? I thought that Jesus' words would have been sufficient to answer that... I do not believe that we are allowed to use some extra biblical means. (At least, I do not have such liberty.) So, in keeping with the Word, let us examine the lives of their followers over time and, according to our Lord, it will be revealed, as all truth is ultimately revealed. He Himself stated, "Yet wisdom is vindicated by all her children" (Luke 7:35). Thus, when we watch them, what we will see is either the fruit of the Flesh (Galatians 5:19-21) or the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22-23). In Him, Doc PS I can no longer take the time to respond to questions that fail to cite pertinent Scripture or objections that are merely pugnacious. My health doesn't allow me to deal with matters of personal opinion or teachings not rooted in the Word. Also, I cannot just keep citing the Scriptures and explaining over and over their significance, to which there is no benefit. Please do not deem this as implying personal criticism -- the failing is mine alone. |
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6 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | EdB | 243272 | ||
Why is it you feel the liberty to post quotes with not scripture cited. Are they not mere opinions also? | ||||||
7 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | DocTrinsograce | 243275 | ||
Dear Ed, Well, to be honest, the opinions men who lived Godly and Spirit filled lives in the past, who were well studied in the Word, and whose lives were well examined by the church over the years... just provide far superior opinions. Their least studied opinions will far excel our best studied ones. Although, at your behest, I have quoted men from Greek Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and even an atheist and pagan philosophers or two, I would just as soon quote people in my tradition. Would you like me to find some quotes of people from your tradition? I have already quoted from the AOG position papers. Is there anyone you'd prefer that I find to quote? I guess the question has to do with "mere opinions." When the clear principles of Scripture are expressed in varying ways by students of the Word, then is that not similar to citing the Word itself? It may not have "thus saith the Lord" in front of it, but if it expresses the very Word Christ, then I would even quote Benny Hinn and Jimmy Swaggart! It is the Word that I love! In Him, Doc PS Sorry, yes, let's go to the proof texts. |
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8 | Baptists | 1 Cor 11:2 | EdB | 243279 | ||
Quotes from established and respected theologians and Bible scholars on Biblical subjects are usually edifying and encouraging. However when a quote is a slam against another accepted denomination or their teaching, they are merely opinions of man and to post them as an innocent quote is wrong. My concern is this is becoming a common occurrence. |
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