Results 1 - 4 of 4
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Spirit Baptism | Acts 8:12 | iktoose | 155360 | ||
Hi C.S.M, First, I want to thank you for the detailed reply. Although you missed my point slightly... but that's okay. We all do. Let me see if I can clarify this so that you may understand my point. In Acts 8:12-17, deacon Philip baptized believers (with water) in the name of Jesus but the believers did not receive the Holy Spirit apparently. Then apostles John and Peter came and prayed for the believers and laid their hands on them (v. 17) and the believers received the Holy Spirit. My understanding as a believer always has been that the Holy Spirit comes into you the moment you receive Jesus Christ into your heart as your Lord and Savior and dwells with you the rest of your life. I also believe that the water baptisim is a ceremony to let the congregation know you are a full pledged Christian. But Acts 8:12-17 seem to contradict my belief. This passage suggests that a water baptism suppose to give the believers the Holy Spirit (v. 16). Also suggests that only Apostles have the authority/power (gift of God) to give the believers the Holy Spirit. Your thoughts on this? iktoose |
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2 | Spirit Baptism | Acts 8:12 | C.S.M. | 155388 | ||
Hi Iktoose, 8-4-05 rest of the answer. Ask yourself, if Jew and Gentile were the whole of all mankind, where is God going to get this third class of people called the church? The obvious answer is, from the whole pool of people, the Jews and the Gentiles. I Cor 10:12, Eph 2:13-16. Back to Baptism: Again who was going to baptize mankind to be witnesses of God to all the world? John 1:33-36 God had told John that Jesus was sent to baptize with the Holy Spirit! Acts 1:8 said this baptism from Jesus, sent from God the Father, was power from God, through the Holy Ghost, to be witnesses to God the Father, and this baptism was NOT done by any man, it was done by the Lord Jesus Christ himself. Jesus is the baptizer with the Holy Ghost. John 1:33. There is a definite difference in water baptism done by a minister, a human being, and Jesus, the Son of God, baptizing a person with the Holy Spirit. Thus the story of Matt 7:9 by Jesus himself...”What man is there of you, whom if his SON ask bread, will he give him a stone? (10) Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? (11) If you then, being evil (unjust, merciless, prideful, disobedient Micah 6:8 the opposite of good) know how to give GOOD (just, merciful, humble, obedient Micah 6:8) gifts unto your children, HOW MUCH MORE shall your Father in heaven give good things to them that ASK him?” Do you suppose Jesus baptizing a person with the Holy Spirit is a good gift from his Father God to mankind? Yes, there is a two fold baptism, outlined in these scriptures, for two different purposes, In the examples given and in the original question. You see, in Acts 8:12, the baptism of repentance first spoken of by John the Baptist. In Acts 8:14-17 you see Jesus, through Peter and John, baptizing them with the Holy Spirit and power, as God said he would, after he was risen from the dead and seated at God’s own right hand. John 1:33, Acts 1:5. Who is this for? Acts 2:38-39 Peter said..repent, and be baptized in the name (or into the name) of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the GIFT of the Holy Ghost. (39) For the promise (of the Holy Ghost baptism by Jesus) is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. Always in Christ, C.S.M. |
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3 | Spirit Baptism | Acts 8:12 | iktoose | 155396 | ||
Dear C.S.M. Thanks again for your lengthy explanation. I have no problem understanding what you stated. However, you have not answered my question to my satisfaction. I stated the following in my previous posting, "My understanding as a believer always has been that the Holy Spirit comes into you the moment you receive Jesus Christ into your heart as your Lord and Savior and dwells with you the rest of your life. I also believe that the water baptisim is a ceremony to let the congregation know you are a full pledged Christian (of course after your admission that you're a sinner and repentence of sin)." Do you disagree with this? Please indicate yes or no. After all, we can always agree on our disagreement (:-). Right? Let me ask this: Do you think deacon Philip's miracles and signs (Acts 8:13) were actually done by Jesus? If so, do you think deacon Philip had apostolic authority and power? If so, why the Samaritan believers did not receive the Holy Spirit when he baptized them? How do you reconcile this event with Acts 2:38-39 as you quoted "Peter said..repent, and be baptized in the name (or into the name) of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the GIFT of the Holy Ghost. (39)" ? Is it your understanding that if you're baptized in the name of Jesus Christ ... and you shall RECEIVE the gift of the Holy Spirit? If so, how would you reconcile that with the event happened in Acts 10:44-48 where Cornelius' household received the Holy Spirit while Peter was preaching? Baptism for them happened after that, not? Do you see the Ethiopian eunuch receiving the Holy Spirit when Philip baptized him? What is the meaning of all these rather contradicting/or inconsistent events? iktoose |
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4 | Spirit Baptism | Acts 8:12 | C.S.M. | 155431 | ||
Hi Iktoose, Yes, the Holy Spirit comes and baptizes you into the body of Christ. The body of Christ did not exist until God sent the Holy Spirit when Jesus was exalted at his right hand. Yes, when a person asks Jesus into their heart, it is the Holy Spirits work to put them into the body of Christ (refer to the previous scripture given in the last post.) It is also the Holy Spirit that empowers them to be witnesses, or perhaps another way to say it is, fills them with Himself and gives them utterance, so they can speak to God in a heavenly language, by the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:4, And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, AND began to speak with tongues, (how?) as the (Holy) Spirit gave them utterance (or speach). Again Jesus said that was to empower believers Acts 1:8, and as you study the happenings when the apostles laid hands on people that same thing happened to them. It is what God told John would come, AFTER the Holy Ghost was dispatched to earth, AFTER Jesus went back to heaven. God didn't tell them everything. But Peter, whom Jesus said, had the KEYS to the kingdom of heaven, discerned what was happening. He recognized it was the fulfilling of Joel 2:28 where God had prophesied through Joel that this would happen in the future. Little did he know it would be thousands of years until that time. That was none of his business, it was God's, and he, as a prophet, had learned that God says some things that are pertinent to the day and also to thousands of years later. There is a five fold ministry, God set in the church, Eph 4:11 He gave some (not all) apostles, SOME prophets, SOME evangelists, SOME pastors and SOME teachers. Note he didn't say everyone would do those things.. Think about it, if everyone was doing the same thing, who would you minister to? Think of Israel, God chose one twelveth of the whole nation to be priest, not all 12 tribes! It's the same with the five fold ministry..Some, not all, are put in the offices. For what purpose? Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the building up of the body of Christ. Jesus was the first body builder. Arnold Swartznigger doesn't even hold a candle to Jesus :) Oops, being wordy again...sorry... No, all people do not have the same job from God. It is God's choice who is an apostle, etc, it is not just because a person decides to "be" an apostle. It doesn't work that way. Hope this is not to wordy...and we are on the same page. There is a work of the Holy Spirit in putting us into the body of Christ, there is a second work of the Holy Spirit to equip the church for ministry "TO" the body of Christ. Isn't that what the Apostles were doing? And yes, water baptism is an outward testimony to all people that your allegience is to Jesus Christ, but that the work has already been done BEFORE you were baptized. An outward show, of an inward change. The new creature God created is what saves you, the baptism is Johns, of repentance, water baptism, not this baptism for service. Always in Christ, C.S.M. |
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