Results 1 - 12 of 12
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Tamara Brewington | 204552 | ||
Dear Val, I am trying to see your point here... That the if a person believes and unites with Christ in hearing the word and are forgiven, having recieved the Holy Spirit the apostles perhaps agree with them in Christ? And that if a person does not receive the word then the apostles retain their sins because they have rejected Christ? This rather makes a lot of sense to me... I had in mind perhaps if someone went and said Jesus did His works by the power of the devil don't forgive them. Here is what was niggling around in my brain; we know that only Jesus has the power to forgive sins. So how is that He breathes the Holy Spirit on them and gives them the power to forgive or retain the sins of any? He did do it, but then that means He gave them power He has given to no one since. Catholics believe that the laying on of hands confers the power and the authority of the apostles, starting with Peter, upon whom I will build My church, and that these powers include the forgiveness or retaining of sins. And this is why they confess to the priests and not to Jesus. I believe the apostles may actually have been given the authority to decide as you point out if someone is saved and forgiven, or that Jesus actually gave them the power under His authority to forgive or retains sins, but only to them and not to any successors. I don't know what you think about this and realize that I should be doing some foot work on this in terms of demonstrating that the Bible states that only Jesus has the power to forgive sins. But why would Jesus give them the power to do something only He could do? It is not really necessary for anyone to see if anyone forgives them other than Jesus. But the fact remains Jesus told them to go do something very specific. God Bless, Tamara |
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2 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204644 | ||
Tamera: It just means that after the gospel is preached to them by the apostles- the choice is up to the person who hears the gospel message. Let me be more clear: One person may hear the message, unite faith with the message, resulting in forgiveness and receive eternal life. Or the person may not unite faith with the message, resulting in hardness of heart. They retain their sins. Their sins are not forgiven because they are not covered by the blood of Christ Jesus. If they go out into eternity in this condition they will die a second death. The second part of your question is the Lord breathing on them. This enabled them to do His work. It is similar to the Old Testament saints where the Holy Spirit was upon a person as a commission for service. The third part of your question concerning Peter, upon whom I will build my church – It is not Peter on whom the church will be built but Peter’s confession and what was that confession –that Jesus is the Christ. Christ Jesus is our foundation. Blessings - Val |
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3 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | DocTrinsograce | 204645 | ||
You wrote, "the choice is up to the person who hears the gospel message." So, the Lord's hands are tied until a person makes this pivotal choice? |
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4 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204649 | ||
I don't want to get in a debate about election and predistination Mr. Doc. OK? I don't know how to answer your questions because I do not think in the same relms as you do. Please don't get stirred up. :-) Blessings Val | ||||||
5 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | DocTrinsograce | 204651 | ||
Ought we not to get stirred up when God's sovereignty is stolen from Him and imputed to fallen men? Don't you get stirred up when our Lord is represented at odds with his divine self-revelation? "I don't know what Calvin taught. I've never studied Calvin. But I have studied the Word of God. And I know the Bible teaches that we are chosen. I know that the Bible teaches that God chose me before the foundation of the world. Ephesians 1 says it. It's very clear. 1 Peter 1 says it. I don't understand it all, but I stand in awe... I know what the Book says!" --Kay Arthur (2003) |
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6 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204652 | ||
I don't know where you get the idea that God's sovereignty is stolen from him and imputed to fallen man. Again, I don't understand your perspective on this Doc. And I agree wholeheartedly that we were chosen from the foundation of the world. I echo with Mrs. Arthur I don't understand it all, but I stand in awe. I also believe we have a choice - that's the doctrine of man's responsibility, is it not? How these two doctrines reconcile no one knows or can explain it. As J. Vernon McGee said - Election is God's part. | ||||||
7 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | DocTrinsograce | 204655 | ||
Believers have a choice because God graciously and miraculously intervenes well before they choose (Ephesians 2:8). He actively and intentionally draws His own -- in their inability to move on their own (Isaiah 9:13; Romans 3:11) -- to Himself (John 6:44). Their redemption is not contingent on their choosing Him (John 1:13), they choose Him because He chose them well before-hand (Ephesian 1:4). Decisional regeneration is a serious error on many fronts. Luther called it "the theology of glory" (man focused, man invented out of his own prideful heart), as opposed to "the theology of the cross" (God focused, God invented and revealed through His Word). |
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8 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204660 | ||
Doc, I hope you will read the entire sermon by Spurgeon. A Sermon (No. 207) Delivered on Sabbath Morning, August 1, 1858, by the REV. C. H. Spurgeon at the Music Hall, Royal Surrey Gardens The system of truth is not one straight line, but two. No man will ever get a right view of the gospel until he knows how to look at the two lines at once. I am taught in one book to believe that what I sow I shall reap: I am taught in another place, that "it is not of him that willeth nor of him that runneth, but of God that showeth mercy." I see in one place, God presiding over all in providence; and yet I see, and I cannot help seeing, that man acts as he pleases, and that God has left his actions to his own will, in a great measure. Now, if I were to declare that man was so free to act, that there was no presidence of God over his actions, I should be driven very near to Atheism; and if, on the other hand, I declare that God so overrules all things, as that man is not free enough to be responsible, I am driven at once into Antinomianism or fatalism. That God predestines, and that man is responsible, are two things that few can see. They are believed to be inconsistent and contradictory; but they are not. It is just the fault of our weak judgment. Two truths cannot be contradictory to each other. If, then, I find taught in one place that everything is fore-ordained, that is true; and if I find in another place that man is responsible for all his actions, that is true; and it is my folly that leads me to imagine that two truths can ever contradict each other. These two truths, I do not believe, can ever be welded into one upon any human anvil, but one they shall be in eternity: they are two lines that are so nearly parallel, that the mind that shall pursue them farthest, will never discover that they converge; but they do converge, and they will meet somewhere in eternity, close to the throne of God, whence all truth doth spring. The entire sermon can be read at Spurgeon.org. It is titled Sovereign Grace and Man’s Responsibility. |
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9 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | DocTrinsograce | 204682 | ||
Ma'am, though I know Kay Arthur personally, and have a number of her books -- even autographed. I have no signed book by Charles Haddon Spurgeon. But I can honestly say that I know Charles Spurgeon even better. I've read the full set of his sermons, plus the many issues of his magazine, the Sword and the Trowel. I've studied his small revisions to the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith -- what he called, "the most excellent epitome of the things most surely believed among us." Spurgeon was a Historic Baptist, moving away from the Baptist Union on these very grounds. Amazing that people still attempt to place him in the camp to which he was so much opposed, the very camp of those who attacked, ridiculed, belittled, and demeaned him. "I suppose there are some persons whose minds naturally incline towards the doctrine of free-will [what we now call decisional regeneration]. I can only say that mine inclines as naturally towards the doctrines of sovereign grace. Sometimes, when I see some of the worst characters in the street, I feel as if my heart must burst forth in tears of gratitude that God has never let me act as they have done! I have thought, if God had left me alone, and had not touched me by His grace, what a great sinner I should have been! I should have run to the utmost lengths of sin, dived into the very depths of evil, nor should I have stopped at any vice or folly, if God had not restrained me. I feel that I should have been a very king of sinners, if God had let me alone. I cannot understand the reason why I am saved, except upon the ground that God would have it so. I cannot, if I look ever so earnestly, discover any kind of reason in myself why I should be a partaker of Divine grace. If I am not at this moment without Christ, it is only because Christ Jesus would have His will with me, and that will was that I should be with Him where He is, and should share His glory. I can put the crown nowhere but upon the head of Him whose mighty grace has saved me from going down into the pit." --Charles Spurgeon He's dead, ma'am... let's not make poor Spurgeon an accomplice to stealing the crown. |
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10 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204683 | ||
Doc, with all due respect I have no idea what your talking about. I just wanted you to read his sermon. When I read up on him I will get back to you. I have some of his books. Peace - Val | ||||||
11 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | stjohn | 204698 | ||
Dear Sister Val: I have through what little time I have been here come to know Doc, on and of this forum, as a man who would not defend himself, but only God's word. I believe too that he would not disparage a Sister, and was only, I think, expressing a desire to share with you. Shalom and God bless John |
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12 | Retain or forgive sins? | John 20:22 | Val | 204706 | ||
Yes I understand and never for a moment thought that was the case. I did go back and read the posts to try to learn. I looked up the terms used and saw one article concerning the altar call. I was not familiar with the original term but after reading the article I understood the defination. Now if it had been said I don't agree with using an altar call I would of known exactly what we were was talking about. I have not been to seminary and am not familiar with the language they use. I am not an intellectual. I did not go to college. I have a high school education. Doc is a wonderful, wonderful person and so are you John. I grew up in the tobacco fields of Tennessee so if you know anything about that life, it was a hard row to hoe, no pun intended!!! | ||||||