Results 1 - 12 of 12
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | bigpooch | 200457 | ||
Yeshua clearly indicates significance in the number of baskets gathered. Is there also some significance in the number of loaves of bread and the number of fish? |
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2 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200459 | ||
Dear bigpooch, Sometimes a number is just a number. There were twelve disciples. Had there been fifteen disciples there would have been fifteen baskets. Reading things into the text beyond what is necessary will inevitably lead into error. In Him, Doc |
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3 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | bigpooch | 200466 | ||
Doc, You stated: "There were twelve disciples." Technically, there were at least 3000 (Acts 2:41) talmidim or disciples; there were twelve apostles. "Had there been fifteen disciples there would have been fifteen baskets." No, there were likely not exactly 12 disciples at the time, but there would only be twelve baskets because they represent the twelve tribes of Israel in the feeding of the five thousand. In the second feeding (of the four thousand), the seven baskets represent all humanity, including the Goyim or Gentiles. In John 16:13, Yeshua states "However, when the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears. He will also announce to you the events of the future." I was hoping for an explanation of the "correct answer"! In Yeshua HaMaschiach, "bigpooch" |
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4 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200468 | ||
Dear bigpooch, So, in addition to finding mystical significance to the number of baskets, you are also suggesting that Jesus gave loaves to 3000 disciples (Matthew 14:20), who then distributed to the 5000 men (v21). :-) In Him, Doc |
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5 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | bigpooch | 200475 | ||
We don't know how many talmidim there were at the feeding of the five thousand (or the second feeding of the four thousand), and it was almost certainly less than a thousand because the talmidim followed Yeshua from place to place and this number was almost certainly greater than twelve and may have included women that are mentioned (some by name) in Luke 8:2-3. Of the 3000 added to the believers in Acts 2:41 (this happened much later), we don't know how many became talmidim or disciples, but to suggest that there were but twelve talmidim is not accurate. It is extremely likely that more than twelve talmidim and less than a thousand helped distribute the bread and the fish for both feedings. Yeshua's question: "Do you not yet understand?" is referring to the answers the talmidim gave in response to the questions about the number of baskets gathered. There is no doubt that Yeshua's ministry is first to the Jews (signified by the twelve baskets) and only later to the Goyim (signified by the seven baskets). The talmidim didn't need to know what (if any) significance the number of loaves or fish had, since they were simply questioned about the baskets gathered. From their answers, it seems they should be able to understand Yeshua in v.15: "Watch out! Guard yourselves from the chametz of the P'rushim (Pharisees) and the chametz of Herod". The number of baskets is not really mystical but clear considering the recipients of Yeshua's ministry. The interesting question in my mind is the number of loaves and how this helps in evangelizing. THAT may have mystical significance, but perhaps not if somebody is able to answer this satisfactorily or "correctly". In Yeshua HaMashiach, "bigpooch" |
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6 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200477 | ||
Hi, Bigpooch... Ah. Sola Scriptura is based in the Antiochian School, not the Alexandrian School, or the much later (and non-Christian) Pardes system. "We affirm that the meaning expressed in each biblical text is single, definite and fixed... "The Affirmation here is directed at those who claim a 'double' or 'deeper' meaning to Scripture than that expressed by the authors. It stresses the unity and fixity of meaning as opposed to those who find multiple and pliable meanings. What a passage means is fixed by the author and is not subject to change by readers. This does not imply that further revelation on the subject cannot help one come to a fuller understanding, but simply that the meaning given in a text is not changed because additional truth is revealed subsequently." --Chicago Statement on Biblical Hermeneutics (Article VII) In addition to being based on sola Scriptura, this forum is also an English forum. Thank you for participating in the forum in accordance with the terms of use -- per the wishes of our gracious host -- to which you affirmed when creating your account. In Him, Doc |
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7 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | Val | 200480 | ||
Doc, why do you suppose David's wife, Saul's daughter had an idol in the house. It seems to me that David would not have allowed that. Is it that the word has been mistranslated or that David did not know about it? I read an article from an archelogical report that they think it might have been rags. It seems like something that large if it were an idol would have been hard to hide. 1 Sam 19:13 Michal took the household idol and laid it on the bed, and put a quilt of goats' hair at its head, and covered it with clothes. |
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8 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200484 | ||
Hi, Val... I'd be loathe to imagine an error in the autograph -- especially since the OT manuscripts are particularly so solid. Translation is always difficult because of the difference in time and culture. Idol is probably as good a word as any. Perhaps figure, image, or talisman might work. I suppose the closest analogy in our own culture might be similar to the Roman Catholic practice of placing a Saint Christopher figure on automobile dashboards. They probably both worked just as well, too! :-) Assuming that they were talismans of some sort, then here is a thought: Given Michal's upbringing, and given that she was a woman with strong personal opinions (trying to be polite here), I'd say it was likely that David was unaware of her possession of such images. On the other hand: I just gave one of the Rabbis a call (at my local Aish HaTorah). He was confident that what Michal used was a decorative statue. Apparently, in some of the wealthier homes, wives would keep a statue of their husbands. The purpose was the same as is our practice today of having photographs of our spouses. I'm uncertain of the accuracy of either of these views. Perhaps, if nothing else, they provide you with further food for thought. :-) In Him, Doc |
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9 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | Val | 200501 | ||
Dear Doc, Very good, thank you so much. Blessings - Val |
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10 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200502 | ||
You're welcome! So are you leaning toward one possibility or the other, ma'am? |
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11 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | Val | 200511 | ||
The view that David was unaware of the image being in the house could be possible. If I am not mistaken he was very young and this was his first wife. How long he got to stay with her I do not know as he had to escape out the window for his life. So it could be possible he didn't address the issue. The second view that it was an image of him for decorative purposes seems possible too. Since her father, Saul, was the king she probably had much wealth or at least a nice house. Since David is called a man after God's own heart we know that his heart was in the right place - serving the Lord of hosts alone. I know I read in one of his accounts that he burned idols of his opponents so surely this wasn't an idol of a foreign god. Another thing that was unclear to me is that he had so many wives and concubines but in 2 Samuel he is told that God gave him the wives. So I am wondering is it just the time period that made this ok compared to the present where this is not ok but we still we go back to the idea of one man and one woman in Genesis. Didn't the Lord tell the men not to multiply wives so how is this ok? 2 Sam 12:7 Nathan then said to David, "You are the man! Thus says the LORD God of Israel, 'It is I who anointed you king over Israel and it is I who delivered you from the hand of Saul. 2 Sam 12:8 'I also gave you your master's house and your master's wives into your care, and I gave you the house of Israel and Judah; and if that had been too little, I would have added to you many more things like these! Deut 17:17 "He shall not multiply wives for himself, or else his heart will turn away; nor shall he greatly increase silver and gold for himself. |
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12 | Number of baskets? Loaves? Fish? | Mark 8:21 | DocTrinsograce | 200541 | ||
Hi, Val... What 2 Samuel 12:7-8 is saying is that God gave to David all that was Saul's. Scholars agree that this turn of phrase doesn't imply that David actually had sexual relations with these women. Robert Jamieson states, regarding this verse, "The phraseology means nothing more than that God in His providence had given David, as king of Israel, everything that was Saul’s. The history furnishes conclusive evidence that he never actually married any of the wives of Saul. But the harem of the preceding king belongs, according to Oriental notions, as a part of the regalia to his successor." In Him, Doc |
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