Results 1 - 2 of 2
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Thy will be done, statement or fact? | Matt 6:9 | stevewill | 137510 | ||
Hello Angel, I’m glad we both agree that the Bible gives specific examples of God using people to do His will. Your examples make it quite clear. My point is that if God did it at certain times and with certain people, isn’t He doing it all the time and with all people? Is there enough examples in the Bible to prove it? Are there words from God and Jesus that say that? I would like to take specific words of God and Jesus and see if this is what they are implying. I certainly understand your position when you say that man has the prerogative to believe God or not. I have been taught that my entire life. Now that I have lived some years, I can’t help but to have the feeling that God is in total control of it all. We are merely players, all of us. Even the Bible points to the book of revelation and the climax of life as we know it. In order for the book of revelation to come to fruition, God must make it happen, not us. God is using us to make it happen. The part of the Lord’s prayer that says, in Matthew “ 13And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.” And lead us not into temptation. Does God lead us into temptation, where we are tempted by Satan? Isn’t that amazing that off all the things that we need and could pray about, Jesus gave us that particular concern. Jesus told us to pray and ask God to not to lead us into temptation because God does lead us into temptation. Mathew 4:1 “Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil.” The Father led Jesus into the desert to be tempted by the devil. Now, Jesus asks us to pray that God not lead us into temptation by the evil one. I believe this is how God works with us. He leads either into temptation or to His Son for salvation. When He leads us into temptation explains all the evil that is in the world that people do. We are born neither good or bad. God leads us into temptation, why, I’m not quite sure. Is it to test us? Maybe. God leads us into temptation throughout our lives and we give in to those temptations more often than not. That is why Jesus told us to repent when God calls us to salvation. We have committed a lot of sins. We sin because we are too weak to resist Satan and his temptations. Now Jesus came to this earth to teach us to pray to God and ask Him to not to lead us into temptation but to deliver us from the evil one. Jesus would not tell us to ask God to lead us not into temptation if God is not leading us. He would not have told us to pray for God’s leading if it were not needed. Jesus gave us the example that we can now resist Satan with the help of the Holy Spirit. This is my other point, we cannot resist Satan without the help of the Holy spirit. We need God to resist Satan. God leads us our entire life into temptation and then He chooses us for salvation and gives us the Holy Spirit to help us resist Satan. He is in control of our entire spiritual life from birth to death. That is why Jesus said to pray, “Thy will be done.” All we do is God’s will. Why would Jesus ask us to pray for God’s will to be done if it were not true. It is not our will that we pray for but God’s will. I believe that we have a physical life and a spiritual life. Jesus told Nicodemus you must be born of water and the spirit. Water represents our physical life and spirit represents our spiritual life. With our physical life we get to exercise our will to make the decisions necessary to take care of our physical needs. Where to work, what to eat, what to wear, etc. I believe God gave us the ability and knowledge to make all the decisions necessary to take from His creation what we need to sustain our well being. But God is in control of our spiritual life, born of spirit. As Jesus said in John 6:44 and 6:65, No one can come to Jesus unless the Father draws him. The Father decides whom He wants to come to Jesus. God is in control of our spiritual lives. He leads us into temptation or unto His Son for salvation. Jesus was quite clear about the Father drawing us to Himself. Didn’t Jesus pray that He not loose any that the Father placed in His hands. John 17:2 “For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.” And in verse 6, "I have revealed you to those whom you gave me out of the world. “15My prayer is not that you take them out of the world but that you protect them from the evil one.” Of all the people that heard Jesus and saw His miracles, only a small number believed He was the Son of God. God granted that knowledge to only those small number of people. As far as our salvation is concerned, God is choosing who He wants to believe in Jesus and who He doesn’t at this time. There will be a second resurrection where everyone will be given the knowledge of Jesus and that will be their opportunity. But not now. May God’s will be done. Steve |
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2 | Thy will be done, statement or fact? | Matt 6:9 | JCrichton | 137580 | ||
Hi, Steve! Part 1 of 2 I know we’ve made strides… so it is with a heavy heart that I once again must disagree with you… “I would like to take specific words of God and Jesus and see if this is what they are implying.” I think that when we read Scripture and we speculate on its meaning we run the risk of seeing (discerning) values that are not coherent with Scripture… True Christ was led by the Holy Spirit to be tempted by Satan… this does not testifies to God’s leading us to temptation… Jesus, being God, could not be tempted by Satan who is a creature--Satan needed God’s Authority to come near Jesus! And while Jesus’ prayer seemingly implies that God can lead to temptation… it is requesting that He protect us from temptation, not that He protects us from His impulses to lead us to temptation! “In order for the book of revelation to come to fruition, God must make it happen, not us.” I agree with this statement 100 percent! We are insignificant when it comes to God’s Divine Plan… still, we are not mere puppets, mere play pieces on a board game… “Stratego,” if I remember the name correctly, is a strategy board game where pieces are placed and war is enacted in an attempt to capture/destroy the opponent army’s flag?… these pieces are completely inert and impotent! It is not so with God’s Divine Plan! True His Will is done and will accomplish His judgment, but we have been created in His image and likeness… we, humanity, has the potential of being His children, not just mere pawns on a predetermined cosmic campaign. Revelation 16:8-11 attests to humanity resolve not to submit to God’s Will--the wicked perish not because they have been coerced by God or Willed by God to perish, but because they reject His Authority and choose to curse Him rather than to serve Him! “Jesus would not tell us to ask God to lead us not into temptation if God is not leading us.” On the surface this statement seems logical and totally correct… but you yourself stated that we cannot resist Satan, a creature who is but insignificant in light of the Almighty’s Power! How could we resist God if He willed us to be saved or to be damned? How could God claim to be a God of Mercy and Love if He Willfully condemns humanity to a life of depravity only impart Judgment against them for being and doing exactly what He Willed them to be? True, this is said of Pharaoh and Israel and the old pagan world--the world under the Old Covenant… but this is said and these things are done because the Word had not become incarnate as of yet… once Jesus came onto the world, He gave humanity the ability to become sons (children) of God… and since He is God, in His Wisdom He also came to those who existed under the Old Covenant so that all, both the dead and the living, would see and benefit from God’s Mercy. (John 11:24-26; Romans 14:9; 1 Peter 3:18-22) As far as God having any part in our temptation Scripture is resolute on this matter: Never, when you are being put to the test, say, ‘God is tempting me’; God cannot be tempted by evil, and he does not put anybody to the test. Everyone is put to the test by being attracted and seduced by that person’s own wrong desires. Then the desires conceives and gives birth to sin, and when sin reaches full growth, it gives birth to death. (James 1:13-15) “All we do is God’s will.” If this were to be so, what gripe does God have with homosexuals and all other sexual immorality, murderers, thieves, liars, drunks… Does your statement not exonerate the villainous murderers of children and the innocent who wage terrorism on the least suspecting and undeserving? Does it not support organized crime, genocide, infanticide, and rampant corruption--in all scales (public and private realms)? After all, those who kill babies and wholesale/retail their parts for “the good of medical advancement” have only God to blame for giving them their skills, their status, their wealth, and their inclination to profit from the killing of our babies and from the marketing of the byproduct of their murderous trade! |
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