Results 1 - 6 of 6
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | What nations did Abraham father? | Gen 17:6 | eklektos | 174887 | ||
Greetings HOTH, Welcome to the forum. Sons of Abraham through Keturah: Gen 25:1 Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. Gen 25:2 And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. Gen 25:3 And Jokshan begat Sheba, and Dedan. And the sons of Dedan were Asshurim, and Letushim, and Leummim. Gen 25:4 And the sons of Midian; Ephah, and Epher, and Hanoch, and Abida, and Eldaah. All these were the children of Keturah. Gen 25:5 And Abraham gave all that he had unto Isaac. Gen 25:6 But unto the sons of the concubines, which Abraham had, Abraham gave gifts, and sent them away from Isaac his son, while he yet lived, eastward, unto the east country. "The second wife of Abraham (Gen 25:1; 1Ch 1:32 f). According to the Biblical tradition, he contracted this second marriage after the death of Sarah (compare Gen 23), and very likely after the marriage of Isaac (compare Gen 24). It is not improbable that, as some writers have suggested, this change in the life of his son prompted Abraham to remarry in order to overcome the feeling of lonesomeness caused by Isaac's entering the state of matrimony. 1Ch 1:32 (and also Gen 25:6) shows us that Keturah was not considered to be of the same dignity as Sarah who, indeed, was the mother of the son of promise, and, for obvious reasons, the sons of Abraham's concubines were separated from Isaac. She was the mother of 6 sons representing Arab tribes South and East of Palestine (Gen 25:1-6), so that through the offspring of Keturah Abraham became “the father of many nations.”" (International Standard Bible Encyclopedia) The prophesy God foretold Hagar about Ishmael: "Gen 16:12 And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren." Hope this helps in your studies, eklektos |
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2 | What nations did Sarah mother? | Gen 17:6 | HOTH | 174895 | ||
Hi eklektos, Thank you for your welcome and your answer. The covenant made in verses 4, 5, and 6 of Gen. 17 appears to me to be a covenant in regards to Sarah and Isaac and not to Hagar and Ishmael or to Keturah. Please correct me if I am in error on this point. Gen 17:20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard and heeded you: behold, I will bless him and will make him fruitful and will multiply him exceedingly; He will be the father of twelve princes, and I will make him a great nation. Gen 17:21 But My covenant, My promise and pledge, I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah will bear to you at this season next year. Verses 20-21 confirm this covenant is established with Isaac. Also verse 16. Gen 17:16 And I will bless her and give you a son also by her. Yes, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of peoples shall come from her. So, let me rephrase my question. What nations did Sarah mother as referred to in 17: 4-6, and 16, other than Israel and Judah? Thanks again, Hoth |
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3 | What nations did Sarah mother? | Gen 17:6 | eklektos | 174896 | ||
Greetings HOTH, Yes, the covenant was between God and Abraham, not God and Sarah. So, the promise also included the tribes of Ishmael plus Isaac. Gen 17:4 As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations. But the promise of the "seed", leading to Christ, was to Abraham through Sarah in Isaac, not with Hagar, for the blood line would be impure, for Hagar was Egyptian. Thus, what we call "half-breed". But in your previous question you asked about the OTHER nations that did not include Israel. "Gen 17:19 And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his ""seed"" after him. Gen 17:20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation." (Double quotes( "" "" ) are mine to show emphasis.) The promise of many nations was fulfilled in Isaac and Ishmael. However, the SEED was the covenant for Christ. Isaac, the seed, was born to lead us through to the lineage of Christ. We know that Isaac gave his blessing on Jacob and not Esau. So, the "seed" continued through Jacob (Gen 27). Jacob was renamed to Israel. And the promise in Gen 17:16 were the 12 twelve tribes of Israel (Jacob)[the seed]. "Gen 35:22 And it came to pass, when Israel dwelt in that land, that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father's concubine: and Israel heard it. Now the sons of Jacob were twelve: Gen 35:23 The sons of Leah; [Reuben], Jacob's firstborn, and [Simeon], and [Levi], and [Judah], and [Issachar], and [Zebulun]: Gen 35:24 The sons of Rachel; [Joseph], and [Benjamin]: Gen 35:25 And the sons of Bilhah, Rachel's handmaid; [Dan], and [Naphtali]: Gen 35:26 And the sons of Zilpah, Leah's handmaid; [Gad], and [Asher]: these are the sons of Jacob, which were born to him in Padanaram. Gen 35:27 And Jacob came unto Isaac his father unto Mamre, unto the city of Arbah, which is Hebron, where Abraham and Isaac sojourned. Gen 35:28 And the days of Isaac were an hundred and fourscore years. Gen 35:29 And Isaac gave up the ghost, and died, and was gathered unto his people, being old and full of days: and his sons Esau and Jacob buried him." Brackets [] are mine to highlight the beginnings of the twelve tribes. Thus, overall, the "many nations" (Gen 17:4,5) included both the twelve nations and the Arab nations. Therefore, after all that, the nations through Sarah were only the twelve. Does this help? eklektos |
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4 | What about Jacob-Israel and Ephraim? | Gen 17:6 | HOTH | 175126 | ||
Hi eklektos, Thanks again for your response. You stated: “Yes, the covenant was between God and Abraham, not God and Sarah. So, the promise also included the tribes of Ishmael plus Isaac.” I think that runs counter to Gen 17:15-21, where God specifically tells Abraham, “But My covenant, My promise and pledge, I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah will bear to you at this season next year.” Abraham pleaded for Ishmael in verse 18. God heard Abraham and gave Ishmael a separate and distinct blessing. Gen 17:15 And God said to Abraham, As for Sarai your wife, you shall not call her name Sarai; but Sarah [Princess] her name shall be. Gen 17:16 And I will bless her and give you a son also by her. Yes, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of peoples shall come from her. Gen 17:18 And [he] said to God, Oh, that Ishmael might live before You! Gen 17:19 But God said, Sarah your wife shall bear you a son indeed, and you shall call his name Isaac [laughter]; and I will establish My covenant or solemn pledge with him for an everlasting covenant and with his posterity after him. Gen 17:20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard and heeded you: behold, I will bless him and will make him fruitful and will multiply him exceedingly; He will be the father of twelve princes, and I will make him a great nation. Gen 17:21 But My covenant, My promise and pledge, I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah will bear to you at this season next year. Further, when God tells Abraham that Sarah “shall be a mother of nations” it confirms this covenant was with Isaac and with his posterity after him. Yet, I do not think that ancient Israel, ancient Judea, and Edom can be looked at as having fulfilled God’s promise to make Abraham a “father of many nations.” Maybe Sarah could considered a “mother of nations”, for these three nations, but I doubt it. The twelve tribes represent only two nations, not twelve. God broke Israel into two nations, no more than that. I ran a key word search of the word “nations” in the book of Genesis. The results are very interesting. Indeed, the promise that Abraham would be a “father of many nations” fell to Isaac’s son Jacob-Israel. In Gen 35:10-11 “Again God said to him, your name is Jacob; you shall not be called Jacob any longer, but Israel shall be your name. So He called him Israel. And God said to him, I am God Almighty. Be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall come from you and kings shall be born of your stock. . . Jacob-Israel, when he blessed Ephraim and Manasseh, the sons of Joseph, the promise of “a multitude of nations” was given to Ephraim. Gen 48:16-19 It seems the promise of the “Seed” went to Judah and the Southern Kingdom of Judea and the promise of many nations went to the Northern Kingdom of Israel, specifically the tribe of Ephraim. We know how the promise of the “Seed” was fulfilled in our Lord Jesus Christ. How was the promise of “a multitude of nations” fulfilled? Thanks again for your help and may God be with you, Hoth |
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5 | What about Jacob-Israel and Ephraim? | Gen 17:6 | DocTrinsograce | 175136 | ||
Dear Hoth, There is an unwritten convention on the forum to use the "Question" button only when addressing the forum as a whole. Followup questions and comments addressed to individuals should use the "Note" button. The individual you're speaking to will receive notification. This practice keeps the home page clear. Thank you! In Him, Doc |
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6 | What about Jacob-Israel and Ephraim? | Gen 17:6 | HOTH | 175146 | ||
Dear Doc, Thank you for the heads-up! Hoth |
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