Results 1 - 5 of 5
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Ordered by Verse | ||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Eternal Security and 2 Peter 2:20 ??? | 2 Peter | jg8ball | 1041 | ||
Since you brought up the topic of Eternal Security, could you please interpret how 2 Peter 2:20 suggests Eternal Security? (2 Pet 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.) To me, this is clearly saying that a believer can lose his salvation. Also, I can't speak for everyone, but everyone that I know that believes that it is possible to lose your salvation also believes FIRMLY that you are saved by faith alone and NOT by any works. I'm not sure where you got the idea that you cannot lose your salvation because you are saved by faith alone. Those are two completely different thoughts. Since the above verse says that a believer can fall away and since Jesus says that no one can steal your salvation away from you, then the only way that I can see of losing your salvation would be for a believer to (for some strange reason) renounce Jesus and turn back to the ways of the world. And since a believer can fall away then that kind of blows the election doctrine as you believe it. As far as the 250 times you quote that "elect" type words appear, Are you kidding? Did you actually look them up. (it's really easy to do using this site - try it) I personally think you just read a post from another user and took for granted that it must be gospel - probably the same way you came to believe in the Doctrine of Election. Of those 250 times, you will actually only find a few that can be used to support the doctrine (until you read it in context). As far as "Free Will" goes, this is a term used to describe all the examples throughout the bible just as Trinity is a word you won't find in the bible but is a word we use to describe the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit being separate and the same. Yes, God has his Elect. They are called believers and ANYONE and EVERYONE can become one if they choose to accept Christ. How about Romans 10:9-11? That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." Please re-read that last sentence a few times. How can you honestly, (logically and spiritually) not believe that ANYONE and EVERYONE has been given the opportunity to be saved? |
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2 | Eternal Security and 2 Peter 2:20 ??? | 2 Peter | kalos | 1045 | ||
If you CAN read,...I mean, if you WILL read 2 Peter 2:1, you will plainly see, if you are acquainted with the English language, that the chapter is speaking of "false teachers...who will secretly bring in destructive heresies." FALSE TEACHERS, not born again, blood washed, Holy Spirit sealed believers. . . . The reason I FIRMLY believe that we are saved by faith alone and NOT by any works is because the Bible repeatedly says so in plain, unambiguous English. See Rom 3:28; Eph 2:8,9. . . . Your question: "How can you honestly, (logically and spiritually) not believe that ANYONE and EVERYONE has been given the opportunity to be saved?" . . . My answer: I NEVER said that I did not believe that ANYONE and EVERYONE has been given the opportunity to be saved. . . . Hello? At 2:53 PM today, I posted the following: . . . What I agree with is the plain and clear teaching of the Bible that says: "whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John 3:15,16 KJV). Many Scripture verses teach the same truth. (See Mt 10:32; 12:50; 16:25; Mark 8:34; 12:8; John 4:14; 11:26; 12:46; Acts 2:21; 10:43; Rom 9:33; 10:13; 1 John 4:15; 5:1; Rev. 22:17.) . . . We learn what the Bible MEANS by what it SAYS. . . . In other Answers and Notes on this website, I have quoted many Scriptures to define and defend the Bible doctrine of election. I said "Bible doctrine of election." I did not say "Calvinism." To throw out that buzzword is to confuse the issue of the Bible doctrine of election. . . . Does the Bible teach hyper-Calvinism? Some say yes, others say no. I say the Bible DOES teach a doctrine of election, label that doctrine what you will. . . . jg8ball, my final word to you is "Good-bye". Adios. Sayanora. |
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3 | Eternal Security and 2 Peter 2:20 ??? | 2 Peter | jg8ball | 1078 | ||
Talk about close minded persons. Yes, verse 1 (and this chapter) talks about false teachers. But, I didn't ask about verse 1, I asked about Verse 20. Since you seem not to want to read that far, I'll break it down in easy to understand terminology for you. 2 Peter 2:20 "If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ..." How does one escape the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord? It doesn't matter who you are. If you escape it, then you are saved. PERIOD. (unless of course you believe there is some sort of "in between" state.) "...and are again entangled in it and overcome" "And again entangled" implies that the person has reverted back to the old sinfull ways "...and overcome..." would imply that the person has lost Jesus. "...they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning." This proves that they are no longer saved because if so, then how could they be worse in the end? Basically, it's telling you that you'd be better off having not been saved at all. Because those that are saved and renounce that salvation to turn back to the ways of the world and spread lies will not be in a good mood at judgement day. By the way, did you get a chance to look up those 250 times the words appear in the bible? Do you still want to use that number? I'm not sure why your eyes have been closed but I pray that someone will be able to open them. |
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4 | Eternal Security and 2 Peter 2:20 ??? | 2 Peter | kalos | 1083 | ||
Verse 20 is part of the verses that make up chapter 2. In v. 20, the word "they" is a pronoun. Every pronoun must have an antecedent (a noun to which it refers). To find the antecedent, you have to keep reading what comes before the antecedent until you find the noun. In this case, the antecedent of "they" (v. 20) is "false teachers" (v. 1). . . . If this answer is too complex, remedial reading classes for adults are offered at many public schools and colleges. Or you may want to read chapter 2 in one of those new versions intended for the illiterate and the subliterate. . . . If you use an exhaustive concordance for the NIV, you too will come up with 250 occurences of the words elect, election, choose, chose, and chosen. You will also find the word "freewill" occurs a total of 22 times in the Bible. Stop riding me about the number of times the above words appear in the Bible. It's a simple matter of statistics, not interpretation. . . . Thank you for getting through one entire question of yours without mentioning the word Calvinism or Calvinist. |
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5 | Eternal Security and 2 Peter 2:20 ??? | 2 Peter | jg8ball | 1085 | ||
I'm not denying that it's talking about false teachers. I'm saying that verse 20 is saying very clearly that it's possible to lose one's salvation. Couldn't it be that the people that were saved and given up the salvation are the false teachers mentioned above. Who would be a better false teacher? One that knew nothing of the Bible or one that knew about it, new the love of Jesus, but later rejected it for the pleasures of the world and began twisting the doctrines with little half-truths to sway people away? PLEASE READ THE WHOLE CHAPTER (or better yet, the whole bible) Don't throw out verses because they don't fit with what you want to believe!!! And as I've repeatedly said, I don't deny the number if instances the words appear. I deny your use of the words to make your point. Take each of those words in context and most have nothing to do with the doctrine of election. And again, the word Trinity does not occur in the bible at all. Does this mean it doesn't exist? NO!! When you respond to a posting, please take your time and read it and try to understand, answer, and address all that was written. |
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