Results 1 - 12 of 12
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: servetus Ordered by Date |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1 | Interpret John 8:24 | John 8:24 | servetus | 234631 | ||
Hey Tim, Sorry for the delay. I was out of town for a couple of days for the holiday in an area without internet service. I read your last post before I left but didn't have time to respond. I've got to say, there wasn't one hour that went by that I didn't think about your response. I thought I knew all the variations of the gospel within the Trinitarian Protestant Religion but I was wrong. I was wondering how you were going to say you disagree with my former pastor when he didn't say anything about UNDERSTANDING the "binity". I was thinking you would say, "Nevermind, I misunderstood you and I do agree with your pastor that one must believe that the Son is co-equal, co-eternal, and con-substantial with the Father". I would have been fine with that. I figured that if you say that Jesus is claiming to be Yahweh then He is obviously "one-being" with the Father which would make him co-equal and co-eternal. I was just trying to get the details to the "heart" of your gospel and what it means to "accept Jesus as the I am". I wasn't trying to get an answer that would disprove the Deity of Christ. I was giving you an opportunity to be dogmatic about your gospel and lay a foundation for a debate with two opposing views. I've got to say, I was not expecting this curveball! So, it's not that I would "RATHER" substitute believe for understand it's that I HAVE TO because my former pastor never said anything about understanding this. So, I hate to put words in your mouth but you gave me the liberty to substitute believe for understand. So once again, my former pastor says, "People will 'die in their sins' if they don't believe Jesus is co-equal, co-eternal, and con-substantial (one being) with the person of Jehovah. If Jesus is claiming to be Jehovah then He is obviously claiming to be the "being" of Jehovah." And your response is "Yes, I agree that Jesus is claiming to be Jehovah in these verses but I disagree with you because one does not have to fully BELIEVE the nature of Jesus." Huh??? I never thought that there could be a degree of belief for salvation. What's the line? It sounds like an agnostic has a better chance under the implications of your gospel than I do. If a disinterested agnostic doesn't really believe that Jesus could be Yahweh but doesn't completely deny it, he would have a lot better chance of salvation under your gospel than a passionate person like myself who has only accepted Jesus as Yahweh's Son. Tim, we have hit a big speed bump. I can't believe this is taking so long. I thought you would have been a lot more dogmatic about the "heart" of your gospel. I know you are saying you are being as direct as you can but your e-mails don't show it. In your first post (234442) you said that Jesus is clearly stating that He is God in John 8:24. In your next post (234450) you said, "One must understand and accept the true nature of Jesus in order to be saved." And then you said in post (234544), "Must someone fully understand the truth of His nature in order to be saved? NO!NO!NO!". Then you finished the sentence to my hypothetical scenario by saying, one does not "have to fully understand the nature of Jesus." Furthermore, you said I was "making too much of the supposed difference between 'understand' and 'believe'" and that if I substituted these two words it wouldn't change the meaning to your answer." I think it definitely does change the meaning of your answer because it seems to be changing the verse to say, "for unless you partially believe that I am he, you shall die in your sins". Does the righteous man live by partial faith? I have never heard this variation to the gospel so let me know if I have misrepresented you. And if I have, let me know what it means to accept Jesus as the "I am". One more question. To get a full grasp of your gospel I was wondering if you have to accept Jesus as the "I am" before salvation or after salvation. As you know I have rejected Jesus being the "I am" so I'm wondering if I am even saved according to your understanding of scripture. God Bless, Andy |
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2 | Interpret John 8:24 | John 8:24 | servetus | 234612 | ||
Hi Tim, Thank you. We all had a great Thanksgiving. It seems like understand and believe have two different meanings to me. It seems like you would have to believe that Jesus is the "Divine nature" of Jehovah unless you will "die in your sins" because He claims the title "I am". I'm still puzzled why you wouldn't agree with the pastor at the coffee shop. If I understand right it is because you don't have to fully believe this since you told andy he can substitute believe for the word understand. But I know people can partially understand some things in the Bible but can people really partially believe some things especially verses that deal with salvation? Sincerely, Servetus |
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3 | Interpret John 8:24 | John 8:24 | servetus | 234549 | ||
Hi Andy, For some reason I think Tim is dodging your question by not completing your sentence. That was well put. I have done a lot of thinking which brought on a lot of confusion but I definitely think it says Jesus is God in the Bible but you shed some light that this is the only verse (John 8:24) that makes it mandatory for a person to believe that Jesus is Jehovah. Thanks for the insight on the LXX on the other feed. I have a lot of studying to do! I hope you had a good turkey day! Servetus |
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4 | Interpret John 8:24 | John 8:24 | servetus | 234548 | ||
Hi Tim, I don't think Andy ever wrote that his pastor said he had to UNDERSTAND the Trinity. He just said that he must believe that Jesus is Jehovah unless he would die in his sins. Andy asked you if you have to believe in a binity in order to not die in your sins. It seems like you would have to say yes if you think Jesus is claiming to be Jehovah by saying "I am". You would have to believe Jesus is consubstantial, equal and eternal with the "being" of Jehovah. Why didn't you complete his sentence? I find this topic to be very compelling and it is even more interesting because I haven't found another VERSE in the Bible that makes it mandatory for one to believe that Jesus is Jehovah. I hope you had a good turkey day! Servetus |
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5 | Is their a good LXX translation | John 8:24 | servetus | 234547 | ||
Hi Tim, I have really looked into this because John 8:24 is a verse that I use for witnessing to people as I think it's important to believe that Jesus is Jehovah. However, I have always felt a little uncomfortable trying to get people to accept and understand that Jesus is the Son of God and God at the same time. I'm also following your other feed called "die in your sins" and might jump in from time to time as I see this feed has moved. I found a good greek Septuagint online and it seems Andy is right in that the text reads "Thus you shall say to the sons of Isreal, HO ON has sent me to you". I e-mailed my pastor and he said he "misspoke" and thought that EGO EIMI was in the place of HO ON. I have actually heard other preachers preach on this and have said that Jesus claimed the same name EGO EIMI that's in the LXX. I have thought a lot about this today and think that Andy has a great point on this as far as titles go. It convicted me that I should be researching a lot more for myself especially since I found some great websites. I hope you had a good turkey day! Servetus |
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6 | is there another verse? | John 8:24 | servetus | 234541 | ||
Doc, I agree with you but I was wondering if there was another verse that makes believing that Jesus is Jehovah a requirement for salvation besides John 8:24? Thanks, Servetus |
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7 | is there another verse? | John 8:24 | servetus | 234525 | ||
Is there another verse that says you must believe that Jesus is God in order to be saved besides John 8:24? | ||||||
8 | Do I need credentials? | John 8:24 | servetus | 234524 | ||
I am new to this forum and I would like to get involved but why would I need to have any credentials. I have read posts for about 6 months and wanted to jump in because I am passionate about John 8:24. Why would I have to have any credentials? I have never heard this before. I disagree with Andy about his interpretation of John 8:24 but I agree with him that one does not have to have any credentials to dialogue. Thanks, Servetus |
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9 | Not fully omniscient? | John | servetus | 234523 | ||
He DID NOT KNOW the time of His return. Does this mean he at least didn't have full omniscience in His humanity? | ||||||
10 | Is their a good LXX translation | John 8:24 | servetus | 234516 | ||
Tim, I have been following the forum here and there for about 6 months and decided to jump on because I am passionate about John 8:24. I even use John 8:24 when I witness to people because I don't think people are truly saved until they believe that Jesus is Jehovah, the One True God. I agree with you that people need to know the nature of Jesus and that He is God and Jehovah. I just e-mailed my pastor who knows a lot about the Septuagint (LXX) and he says that the word ego eimi is in the Septuagint so I don't know why you don't give Andy this Septuagint translation and this debate would be over. Is their a good Septuagint translation online? Thanks, Servetus |
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11 | Mark 13:32 | Not Specified | servetus | 234513 | ||
If Jesus is fully omniscient then how does he not know the time of His second coming in Mark 13:32? | ||||||
12 | Mark 13:32 | John | servetus | 234514 | ||
If Jesus is fully omniscient then how does he not know the time of His second coming in Mark 13:32? | ||||||