Results 1161 - 1180 of 1251
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Results from: Notes Author: mark d seyler Ordered by Verse |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
1161 | Plain or Intended Meaning? | 1 Pet 2:24 | mark d seyler | 165925 | ||
Hi Atdcross, I would simply ask you to examine all the uses of the words in question in this passage throughout the New Testament, and see it the definitions as you have offered will actually work in those usages. I do not think that they will. The simplest example, not to speak anything against any of these scholars who have had much greater education than I have, but to define hate as "unjustifiable, malicious feelings" is to accuse God of wrongdoing for "hating" Esau. And that cannot be correct. I am not saying that Jesus spoke other than what he meant, I am saying that how we understand some of the words used is different than how they understood them then. My suggestion, to learn what these writers meant when they used a particular word, is to examine every occurrance in the Bible of that word. Determine what the meaning is within its context, find the common thread that connects them all, and you will be able to infer the meaning. I understand what you are saying about the oriental frame of reference, however, that does not as such determine the meanings of words, but rather how they are used. You can detest, abhor, "hate" as we think of it, someone, in feeling, thought, word, and deed. You can also disfavor, demote, subjugate, disapprove someone in feeling, thought, word, and deed. One is visceral, and one is willful. This is willful. If we are to say that, for instance, miseo is defined according to what you have said, even thought that definition does not work eveywhere it is used, that those instances actually mean something other than what the word means, we are left with the task of determining what it actually means. And who is to do that? You? Me? The guy down the street? If we approach scripture that way, we will all come up with something different, and we will remove the objective meaning from the Bible, and it will be no better for us than reading Dr. Seuss. Now, I like Dr. Seuss, but we already have him, and what we need is the Bible, telling US what IT means. If we simply come to the text prepared to receive whatever it offers, and carefully and thouroughly study it, it will reveal itself without conflict, without inconsistencies, and without having to redefine words to fit difficult passages. By the way, you may want to check out "The Language of Jesus", by Douglas Hamp. He presents a very strong case from Biblical, historical, and literary sources that the Jews spoke Hebrew as their primary language until 130 AD. This simply backs up what the Bible already says, that they spoke Hebrew, although this is changed in many Bibles to be Aramaic to match the modern belief. Oh well... Love in Christ, Mark |
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1162 | Sickness Brings God Glory? | 1 Pet 2:24 | mark d seyler | 165926 | ||
Hi Atdcross, I would like to join with Brad in commending you for your patience, and kind spirit that you have demonstrated throughout this thread. I would like to suggest that we end this thread on this note, as we are beginning to repeat points made and answered previously. Thank you for bearing with me. I appreciate the effort and research you have put into this. But I question how much we will be able to add that has not been covered in well over fifty posts since this topic was most recently opened. I trust we will be able to cover our next topic as thouroughly! :-) Love in Christ, Mark |
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1163 | Should we pray outside of God's will? | 1 Pet 2:24 | mark d seyler | 166101 | ||
Hi MJH, Jesus said, "there is only one good, God". So these "good" people to whom "bad" things happen do not exist. Luke 18:19 And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone. Only God knows the conclusion of a matter before it's completed its course, so only God is qualified to tell us if something that happens to us is good or not. Is 46 9 "Remember the former things long past, For I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is no one like Me, 10 Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things which have not been done, Saying, 'My purpose will be established, And I will accomplish all My good pleasure'; To even say that something that happens to us is bad is to go beyond what we can know. This is true regardless of what the circumstance is. If we are praying for God's will to be done, then we are praying for trials. James 1 2 Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, 3 knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance. 4 And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing. The trials are for our good. God wants us to be complete and mature. That's what God says. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1164 | Guidance with couples bible study.. | 1 Pet 3:1 | mark d seyler | 174905 | ||
Mike Murdock's primary television ministry is to convince people to send money to him. He even says if you don't have it, borrow it to send to him. He claims that the automatic result will be that you will receive back "magically" thousands and thousands of dollars. Automatic! Count on it! Hogwash! The apostles taught that the one who asks for money is the false prophet. 2 Peter 2:3 "And by covetousness, with well-turned words, they will use you for gain," Don't be fooled, Mike Murdock does not seek for your spiritual well being - he wants your money. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1165 | How do we respond to Sam Harris? | 1 Pet 3:15 | mark d seyler | 177130 | ||
Hi Parable, I regret that I lack the time to give a more detailed answer to you, but I can offer you this. If you word-search "faith" in the Bible, you will find, among other things, that: Without faith, you cannot please God. You must believe that He exists, and is a rewarder of those who seek Him. God has given to each of us a measure of faith. By grace we are saved through faith. We are kept by the power of God through faith. Faith is mandatory - without faith, you cannot be saved. BUT - only faith in God. You can believe all you want in a false god, and that faith won't save you. James also speaks of a faith that won't save you, which is a faith that doesn't prove itself in your life. Murderers may claim faith, but theirs isn't the faith the Bible teaches. Just because someone says that they have faith, so what? And just because someone else has a false faith, or faith in a false god, that doesn't mean that faith itself is bad, or that faith in the true and living God isn't required. So my response would be, in a nutshell, that Mr Harris is throwing the baby out with the bathwater, a poor practice indeed. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1166 | How do we respond to Sam Harris? | 1 Pet 3:15 | mark d seyler | 177217 | ||
Hi Parable, I'm a bit confused. Could you explain how you, or Mr. Harris, are using the word "religion", in that it is considered a burden to the world? Do you mean the practice of works to become acceptable to God? Is this the same way Mr. Harris is using the word? Love in Christ, Mark |
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1167 | How do we respond to Sam Harris? | 1 Pet 3:15 | mark d seyler | 177221 | ||
Hi Parable, The Scripture that comes first to my mind in context to this discussion is: John 5:39-40 (39) You search the Scriptures, for you think in them you have everlasting life. And they are the ones witnessing concerning Me. (40) And you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life. These people were trying to separate the Book from the Author. They wanted to set the terms, while even using the very Word of God itself! Jesus is saying, basically, "you can search this Book all you want, but if you don't come to Me you will not have life." And if that is true of the actual Word of God, how much more true is it of any writings, philosophies, or any practice of religion that is not from God? So I would agree that the "practice of religion", or "works to gain acceptance", leads mankind to think that they are OK with God, and is detrimental to them, because it disguises the fact that they are still dead in their sins. While I haven't read Mr. Harris's book, if seems from what you have said that he includes faith as a part of religion, as he attacks faith itself. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1168 | How do we respond to Sam Harris? | 1 Pet 3:15 | mark d seyler | 177225 | ||
Hi Parable, This last post helps me tremendously to understand what is being said. This first paragraph contains a presupposition which I do not agree with. This presupposes that the objects of all faiths are harmful. While that is true in many cases, it is not true in all cases. I would also take exception with your pastor's message. Hating to be wrong, and certainty of being right, do not automatically lead to hating those we disagree with. The problem with this is that, while it may be true in many instances, the Bible tells us to love others. This love, "agape", is "love which causes us to devote ourselves to the wellbeing of the object of that love." So tell me, how does that love lead us to kill the unsaved simply for being unsaved? (I am excluding the topic of capital punishment.) The terrorist "suicide/murderer" is not showing agape love towards others. And this proves that they are not living according to the Christian faith. Those who live according to the Christian faith are spending their lives helping others. The one who is growing in hatred is not growing in Christ. The one who is completely correct in Biblical doctrine knows that condemnation and vengeance are not for them to exact. The primary benefit of Christian Faith is only available through that faith - the salvation of our souls. We can only be reconciled to God through faith in Jesus - a mystical, supernatural faith that will not stand still for scrutiny in the lab. As far as "surrendering our right to be right" - I hardly know what to say to this! The Bible is true, and I will live and die on that belief. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life, and no one comes to the Father except by Him. And if someone feels they must kill me because I believe that, and they have the power to do so, I will likely die, because I will not step down from that truth. We are not here to be at peace at the expense of truth. The truth MUST be proclaimed. And make no mistake, darkness will try to destroy the truth, although, ultimately, it can't. Christ didn't kill His enemies, but rather He died that they could have life. We are to do the same. So if Harris must disagree, let him disagree with a true Christian, who would not kill him for his disbelief, and let him not disagree with those who would. Because we are different. We serve a true and living God. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1169 | How do we respond to Sam Harris? | 1 Pet 3:15 | mark d seyler | 177229 | ||
Hi Parable, Thank you for your clarifications. I agree completely with Harris's conclusions regarding Islam. I would contend that it is not the "faith" that is the problem, as Harris rightly concludes that faith connects us to it's object, but having faith in the wrong object - that's the problem! I think I understand what you are saying about "surrendering your right to be right", and "making that the issue". If it makes me arrogant, or I cease to act in love, I can be right, but how I then act because I know I am right can be wrong. About the power of God in weakness, I love the example of Moses. After his crushing failure in Egypt, he took up the shepherd's staff, but it was that staff that God used to perform mighty miracles. Hebrews directly contradicts Harris, in saying "without faith it is impossible to please God, because you must first believe that He exists, and is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him." Harris would say "I don't have a problem with God, just with anyone believing in God." Regarding his neuralogical studies, we know that we who are born again are spiritual beings which cannot be seen contained in physical bodies which can be seen. But no matter how long you study how the electrical charges move through the circuits of a radio receiver, you will not hear the music through you schematics, and graphs. He wants to watch the oscilliscope, but he won't plug in a speaker, and knows nothing of the difference between Wagner and Bach! We know that cocaine mimics the physiology of accomplishment, and other drugs also mimic natural physiology, but as the scientists study those, they recognize that there is a "true", or "natural" physiology, and a conterfeit, which takes advantage of the true. There are many who believe in a false god, and they are liable to do anything. There are many who hold false beliefs about the true God, and they also are liable to do anything. But those that hold true beliefs about the true God, oh, but that the world were full of those! That would be heavenly! But I am afraid that Mr. Harris would no sooner differentiate between those, then he could tell whether a lightbulb is shining through a blue lens or a green lens by examining the electricity that flows through the filament. Love in Christ Mark |
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1170 | Dr. Rebecca Brown? | 2 Pet 1:3 | mark d seyler | 153302 | ||
Hi Journey Me, Lets take for example your loins girded in truth. If you know the truth, you will be prepared against any lies, no matter what they are. It is not required that you study and learn what every lie is that people, or devils, tell. When the bankers train their tellers how to spot counterfeit money, they do not have them handle counterfeit bills, they only handle real bills. Then when the counterfeit comes along, whatever its characturistics, they know its not the real thing, because they know what the real thing is. If you know the truth, it will stand against any lie, whether its one you've heard before or not. Look at the shield of faith. It will quench those fiery darts, no matter what brand, or from what direction. You don't need to learn every type of fiery dart, you just need to believe in God's protection, and lift up that shield! Sometimes God directs people to write books, and sometimes God directs people to read those books. But unless He is directing you to do so, I think your time is much better spent studying the Scriptures. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1171 | Looking for Dawn | 2 Pet 1:4 | mark d seyler | 161361 | ||
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. These are the qualities that render you effective, both active and with results. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins. Because these are the things that make you effective, if you do not have them you are blind, and unable to see far away, and you have forgotten you were cleansed from your old sins. So if you can see, seeing far away, you will have these things. What is it that you see, from far away, that causes you to have these qualities? What does this have to do with remembering that you have been purged from your sins? Is this seeing the usefulness of these qualities, the end result of this kind of life? Seeing Jesus, and how we will be like Him? Seeing how God is changing us now, to be like Him? 10 Therefore (consequently), brethren, be even more diligent (using speed and effort) to make your call (your invitation) and election (the confirmation of the choice) sure, for if you do these things (adding each one upon the last) you will never stumble; 11 for (gar - by this reason) so (in this way, in like manner) an entrance (eisodos) will be supplied (epichorgete) to you abundantly into the everlasting (eternal) kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. We add these things one to another because in this same way God will add to us an abundant entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. This is a future tense entrance, in which we will have the full rich measure of those qualities listed above: Faith, Virtue, Knowledge, Self-Control, Perseverance, Godliness, Brotherly Love, Devoted Love. We will have total faith, able to move mountains. We will be purged of all that is evil, and filled with God’s goodness and strength. We will know even as we are known. We will have complete self-control, being no longer affected by a fallen nature. We will continue through eternity. We will have a perfect heart towards God. We will have love in our hearts for all our brothers and sisters. We will be like Jesus, Who is a servant, and will serve others in love. But God has no intention of us simply waiting until then. Because He will do it then, we must do it now. Put on the new man. Put on Christ. As we do this, adding virtue, knowledge, self-control, perseverance, godliness, brotherly love, devoted love, we become more of who we are, who God made us as. What we have been looking at are seeing here is step-by-step instructions on how we “put on Christ.” Gal 3:27 “For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” Eph 4:21 “if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus: 22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts, 23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness!! We are to add these qualities now, because this is the way He will add them in rich abundance then. Philippians 2:12 “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.” Remember the picture of the sunrise, “as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts;" One day, we will experience this, as “the morning star rises in our hearts,” as the “sun of righteousness rises with healing in His wings.” One day we will see Him! We have this faith in us, as a light shining in a dark place, but as we see Him it rises, His goodness floods through us like those first rays of dawn, And we know - we know His power, and His purpose, and His majesty, And that His fire cleanses us, washing over us, purging us of all our sins. We are free from sin, we will never sin anymore, We finally actually possess our souls - having lost our life, now we've gained it, Eternity stretches out before us - we are forever free! For the God Who has done this for us, we worship Him and praise Him, Truly now with our whole hearts, joined to our entire heavenly family With love and devotion. The night is over, the day is now here, In the full light of perfection and wonder and beauty and light, As we have once and for all put on the new man, Which is created in righteousness and true holiness!!! 12 For this reason I will not be negligent to remind you always of these things, though you know and are established in the present truth. |
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1172 | What does the word "these" reference? | 2 Pet 1:4 | mark d seyler | 163364 | ||
Hi Momma, I saw his post as soon as I posted mine. Either way, this is somewhat difficult for me to get my mind around. Either "for by (all things that pertain to life and godliness given to us) He has given to us His precious and magnificent promises", or "for by (His own glory and virtue) He has given to us His precious and magnificent promises". The antecedent of "these" (vs. 4) would be the conveyor that brings to us His promises. His promises come either through what He has given us pertaining to life and godliness, or they come through His glory excellence. The granting of all that pertains to life and godliness seems more in keeping with the idea of being a conveyor of promises than do the qualities of having glory and virtue. One is already a gifting, the other is God's nature. Looking at it this way, and in keeping with what Tim shared with us, I would say: God has given us all things that pertain to life and godliness, and in giving us these things, He gives us His great and precious promises, which enable us to escape the corruption that is in the world by lust. This makes sense to me! What do you think? Love in Christ, Mark |
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1173 | Add to your faith | 2 Pet 1:5 | mark d seyler | 158111 | ||
2 Peter 1 5 add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. Each of these build on the faith we are given. Faith Believing in Jesus - That first spark of light Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; Ro 12:3 ...God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. God gives us faith, and we build upon that. Our faith is in Jesus, the only true foundation. Virtue, knowledge, self-control, perseverance are directed at ourselves. Virtue Excellence, Strength – goodness, the best you can do, “setting your sights high” Believing God, being born again, opens a whole new life. Now we step into it, seeking good, Col 3:2 “Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.” Php 4:8 ...whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, are just, are pure, are lovely, are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.” Virtue adds intent to faith. Knowledge Adding knowledge means learning Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him (Jesus): “Learn of Me” Believing in Him, wanting good, we learn what God wants for us, and focus in that direction. We learn from the Bible, and yield ourselves to it, humbly seeking to be taught. Knowledge adds direction to virtue. Self-Control To be strong over self, not give in to sin, apply what I have learned Thoughts Actions Words Behaviors Ro 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. Learning what God’s will is for us, we deny the flesh, and serve God’s Spirit. Self-Control adds application to knowledge. Perseverance Patient, hopeful endurance, to continue in self-control Ac 2:42 And they continued (same word) steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. To continue to deny the flesh, and serve the Holy Spirit. This looks forward to the revealing of God’s righteousness. Perseverance adds endurance to self-control. Godliness, brotherly love, and devoted love are all directed to others. We need to experience a certain level of personal growth to be able to outwardly manifest our new life. Godliness The right heart toward God. 1 Timothy 4:8 For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come. This word for godliness means “well-worshipping”. This is what Jesus spoke of to the Samaritan woman in John 4:24 “God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.” This “well-worshipping” is to live recognizing God’s rightful place as Supreme Lord, Creator, Master, Savior, and Father. This affects everything we think, do and say. To worship Him in spirit and truth is to give Him His rightful place in our lives, inside our hearts, minds, and actions. Godliness adds purpose to perseverance. Brotherly Kindness (love) - Affectionate love for others - The love that we feel How do we add a feeling? Our choices affect how we think. How we think affects how we feel. Romans 1 shows this. The Nazi guard goes along with the holocaust. He learns to think of his prisoners as less than human. Hatred and contempt follow. A missionary decides to minister to a savage tribe. He learns to think of them as God’s special chosen people. Love follows. Part of understanding Who God is, is understanding His love for people. As we choose to serve, we follow in Jesus’ footsteps. We foster kind thoughts towards others, choosing to want well for them. We learn to see others as God sees them, and affectionate love, as God loves, follows. Brotherly kindness adds “warm fuzzies” – emotional involvement of the heart – to godliness. Love (Agape) Devoted love for others - The love that we do 1John 3 16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him? 18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth. 19 And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him. Agape Love adds action to brotherly kindness. |
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1174 | Can a slave desire to be free? | 2 Pet 2:19 | mark d seyler | 164419 | ||
Hi Ebrain, I like your answer! In the context of the verse referrenced, I am asking if someone is a slave to sin, or of corruption, can they desire to be free? Love in Christ, Mark |
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1175 | Modern Observation in Light of Scripture | 2 Pet 3:4 | mark d seyler | 177550 | ||
2 Peter 3:4 And say, Where is the promise of His coming? For since the forefathers fell asleep, all things have continued exactly as they did from the beginning of creation. There is a common presupposition underlying all scientific dating methods, and that is the idea that what we see happening now is an accurate portrayal of what happened in the distant past. Peter states this quite succinctly in his letter: "all things have continued exactly as they did from the beginning of creation." At the risk of being repetitious, those who observe current phenomena, and based on those observations, calculate a rate of change, and then apply that rate of change historically to determine how long that change has been occuring are assuming, without the benefit of observation, that the rate of change has remained consistant since the beginning. This is exactly the thing that Peter warns against. "all things have continued exactly as they did from the beginning of creation." 2 Pet 3:5 "For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water," Creation is outside of the realm of observable science - There were not any scientists there to see it, so no matter what we may think happened, we do not actually know. Some have claimed, and appear to have demonstrated, that nuclear and molecular interaction durations have changed, and are subject to change according to the physical environment they occur in. We know that nuclear interaction durations are subject to the local gravitational field. Nuclear clocks keep different time depending on their distance from the center of the earth (altitude), or in other words, their position in the "gravity well". What other factors affect them? We know that plants grow remarkably different (faster, larger) in higher oxygenation and pressure. We know that during longer summers, lake plankon complete several life cycles, not just one. Carbon dating presupposes that the rate of cosmic radiation which produces the C14 has always been the same. Isotope dating presupposes that the atomic decay rates have always remained the same, and that nothing has happened to change them. 2 Pet 3:6 "through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water." How complete was that destruction? Were planetary orbits affected? What cosmological factors were affected? Did the earth lose a water canopy, allowing cosmic radiation to strike the earth that had never done so before? Did the earth receive a burst of radiation of some kind? Had the atmosphere been pressurized? No one knows. So whether one is counting subatomic particles, or diatoms, or tree rings (there are no trees 13 billion years old!) one is assuming that all things have continued exactly as they did from the beginning of creation. And Peter tells us that just isn't so. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1176 | Does one day equal one thousand years? | 2 Pet 3:8 | mark d seyler | 164409 | ||
Hi Bows44, I would agree with what Doc wrote, that this verse is telling us that God views time differently than we do. I believe in a literal 7 day creation. About this being the 6th prophetic day, that doesn't really work. If you add up the ages at fatherhood in the genealogies, add the times of the sojourn in Egypt and of the judges, add the durations of the reigns of the kings, bringing you to the modern dating system at the time of the Babylonian captivity, you can fairly estimate the age of the earth at about 6180 years or so. Its not possible to be exact, because we are only given years, not months. Also, the possibility exists that kings or sons have been left out, however, in my opinion, unlikely that may be. But even if there were some left out, that would only increase the age of the earth. At any rate, it seems fairly certain that we are in the 7th millenia since creation already. These are some of my thoughts. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1177 | Why does Jesus come as a thief? | 2 Pet 3:10 | mark d seyler | 188129 | ||
Hi Hoppy, How then do you relate this to those passages that go into greater detail on this, such as: 1Th 5:1 And concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need of my writing to you, 1Th 5:2 for yourselves have known thoroughly that the day of the Lord as a thief in the night doth so come, 1Th 5:3 for when they may say, Peace and surety, then sudden destruction doth stand by them, as the travail doth her who is with child, and they shall not escape; 1Th 5:4 and ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day may catch you as a thief; 1Th 5:5 all ye are sons of light, and sons of day; we are not of night, nor of darkness, ? I answered based on the totality of Scriptures that speak towards this. If you have a different opinion, that's fine. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1178 | Why does Jesus come as a thief? | 2 Pet 3:10 | mark d seyler | 188137 | ||
Hi Hoppy, I have to sometimes be quick too! :-) I think that the rapture and the Day of the LORD are different things, and that Paul and Peter are talking about the Day of the LORD, when God will judge the wicked, and establish His rule upon the earth. Love in Christ, Mark |
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1179 | Why does Jesus come as a thief? | 2 Pet 3:10 | mark d seyler | 188159 | ||
HI CDBJ, To me, that they are called the servants of God, "douloi", means that these are believers. They are called that before they are sealed, so belief comes first, then sealing. IMHO Love in Christ, Mark |
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1180 | Why does Jesus come as a thief? | 2 Pet 3:10 | mark d seyler | 188165 | ||
HI cheri, One thing to keep in mind, there are two gatherings when Jesus comes in power and glory. The first is Matt 24:31, as He sends His angels to gather the elect. The other is Matt 25:32, as all the nations are gathered before Him, and are separated into the righteous and the unrighteous. That there are righteous amongst the nations that are gathered in 25:32 means that the elect of 24:31 are not all the redeemed. That there are elect gathered in 24;31 means that the same is true of 25:32. The "sheep" of Matt 25 are judged according to thier treatment of "Jesus' brothers". This must be a separate group, otherwise it is circular. The only other separate group are these elect. The elect are not amoung the nations, which are gathered separately. Some very solid conclusions can be drawn from these things. Neither of these gatherings can be the rapture. It is a logical impossibility. Paul said, "we how are alive and remain". All the living redeemed will be caught up. The elect are the Jews. The non-Jews are gathered as the "nations", and judged according to their treatment of "Jesus' brothers". The "catching up" of the redeemed must occur BEFORE these two gatherings, otherwise, those redeemed would be a part of one of these two gatherings. Love in Christ, Mark PS I haven't forgotten about your request, I need the time to put something together. . . |
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