Results 81 - 100 of 150
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: jg8ball Ordered by Verse |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
81 | Can a believer lose his salvation? | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 252 | ||
This verse does not imply that once you are saved you are always saved. Jesus says if you come to Him, He will not cast you out. It does not say that the person will still be saved if they renounce their salvation. | ||||||
82 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 309 | ||
I have a couple questions with what you stated. 1: Where does it say that Jesus is omnipotent? Jesus says in Mat 24:36 "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven nor the Son, but only the Father." If Jesus were omnipotent as you say, He would have known the day and hour. 2: God has predetermined that his plan of salvation will be carried out. This does not mean that he has predetermined who will and will not be saved. God wants everyone to be saved (If you need several versus to back this up, let me know). He provided the means for that to happen through the death and ressurection of Jesus. It is our choice whether to accept his Gift or not. From the very beginning, Adam and Eve made the choice to eat from the tree of knowledge even after God told them not to. In Josh 24:15, "But if serving the LORD seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve... In 1 Kings 18:21, the worshippers at Mt. Carmel were invited to choose that day whom they would serve, either Baal or God. In Isaiah 5:20, the people were certainly capable of choosing between good and evil. Why are we given the warning in Matt 7:15 ("Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.") if we were predestined to be saved or not? Matt 7:21 says that only the people that choose to do the will of God will enter Heaven. Luke 13:3 tells us that unless we repent (our choice), we will perish. Matt 19:23-24 says that it is harder for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God. If we were predetermined, then wouldn't it be just as easy (or hard)? John 3:16 ...whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. In John 7: 17-18, If anyone chooses to do God's will, he will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own. He who speaks on his own does so to gain honor for himself... In Romans 1:17-32 is clear that man has chosen evil and is not predetermined to do so. Heb 9:27-28 tells us that we are to face judgment when we die. What would be the need of a judgment if we were predetermined. There are many more versus that talk about our choice which I will post if needed. 3: To renounce your salvation would be to turn your back on God, to no longer believe or accept his Gift. To no longer follow the teachings of Christ. Granted, you could always say that person wasn't really saved then. But then what would you say would have happened to that person if they died prior to that drastic change? And if you say that the person must not have been chosen by God to be saved and was only fooling themselves when they truely believed in Christ and thought they were saved then can you say for sure that anyone is saved? Did Jesus die for everyone or just for a select few? I can show you several versus that show that He died for all, can you show one that says otherwise? Then if Jesus did die for all, how could there be some that God predetermined not to be save? |
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83 | How do you then interpret the verses... | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 321 | ||
How do you then interpret the verses I listed (and the many others) that talk about "our choice"? I've talked to other Calvinists and they all ignore the verses about our choice in the Bible and quote out a few verses that can be interpreted to fit their needs. The "Free Will" theory holds up throughout the Bible while the "Predestined" theory holds up only in a few parts of the Bible and each of these parts can also be interpreted using the "Free Will" theory. ---------------------------------- You mentioned John 6:44. I agree that no sinner can make the first move in the salvation process. Fortunately, God has already made the first move through Jesus. It's now up to us to accept this. Also, if you put John 6:44 in context and read the entire section, you'll see a whole different meaning. John 6:38-40 - tells us that Jesus is sent to do the Father's will which is that EVERYONE who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life. John 6:44 in simply saying that no one is going to Heaven unless God Allows it. God wants everyone to be saved (this is backed up by other verses I'll supply if needed). John 6:45 "...EVERYONE who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me." It doesn't say "only those I choose will come to me" John 6:47 "I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life." John 6:51 "...This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world." He's saying that he will give his life for the world, not a elect group in the world. ------------------------------------- Eph 1:4-5,11. Again, put it in context. God predestined us as a whole not a group to have the opportunity to be saved. When it talks about us being predestined for foreknew, it's talking about God's plan - that through Jesus we can be saved. When it talks about the Elect, that's simply another way to talk about the people that have accepted Jesus. Today, we use the terms Christian, born-again, believers, etc... Back to Ephesians, at the end of chapter 1, Paul tells them that they were included in Christ when they heard the word of truth, the gospel of their salvation. In other words, when they heard about Jesus, they were included in God's plan. Paul next states that "Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,..." Notice the "Having believed" -- this implies that they had a choice to believe or not. ------------------------------------ A couple other question to ponder: If God chooses only some people to be saved and not others and we have no control over that then why did Adam and Eve eat the fruit? Why did God flood the world to remove all the evil people? Why did Jesus have to die for our sins? If God decides alone who will and will not go to Heaven, why did these things (and others) happen? But if God wants everyone to be saved, but through his great love allows us to make the choice, then these things are easily explained. |
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84 | How do you then interpret the verses... | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 358 | ||
Thank you for the list of Calvinistic views (I've seen them several times now). What I'm wondering though is why you (or other Calvinists) will not discuss what I've submitted earlier. Instead, all I ever get is the same list of verses which when taken out of context point to what you would have me believe. I have looked at this from your viewpoint and tried to see how it fits in. I've even talked with a person from my church (which happens to have many calvinists) but have found too many holes in the theory. If you can offer any sound evidence I would like to hear it. Also, have you actually read the verses in context (that is -- not just the verses but the whole chapter, or better yet the books they reside in) or is this just what someone has told you is right and that was good enough for you? I don't mean to sound harsh but what I'm getting at (and this may or may not apply to you) is that you have to read the Word for yourself. Be open to different interpretations. Pray about it. Look at who the book was written to or for. Look at what the author says in other areas. Decide for yourself if what you have been taught is accurate. Be willing to question your beliefs if you find something contradictary to what the Bible teaches. A good example of this is a friend of mine that was raised a Jehovahs Witness. After showing him parts of the Bible and having him look at it from different view points, he's finding inconsistancies with what he was taught. |
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85 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 463 | ||
Do you actually believe what you wrote? I said God's plan of salvation was predestined. That is, He knew it was going to happen and it will happen no matter what. However, individuals are not predestined to be saved. God wants all to be saved but knows that not all will accept his gift of Grace. God's Will will succeed no matter what man may do. 1 Tim 2:1-7 I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone--for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men--the testimony given in its proper time. Please keep the verses you spout off in context. I have showed you many verses (in context) that talk about our choice and have showed you your verses (in context) that either have nothing to do with what you are using them for or could also be interpreted as free will. I have not seen one verse (taken in context) that says otherwise. Don't you wonder why there are so many verses that talk about "Free Will" and that the only verses Calvinists come up with are taken out of context and based on a faulty premise or that you have to twist the words of non-calvinists to imply things that were not stated? Please read the entire bible. Not just the verses that, on the surface, seem to fit you interpretation. Eph 2:1-2 - The "dead in transgressions and sin" is not a literal term. How could he be talking to them if they were dead? What he's telling the Ephesians is how they are no longer following the ways of the world (they are dead to those ways) but are now saved through the Grace of God in Jesus Christ. Later in that same chapter he tells us that the Gentiles used to be separte from God are now included in the promise of being saved through Jesus. As I stated previously: You mentioned John 6:44. I agree that no sinner can make the first move in the salvation process. Fortunately, God has already made the first move through Jesus. It's now up to us to accept this. Also, if you put John 6:44 in context and read the entire section, you'll see a whole different meaning. John 6:38-40 - tells us that Jesus is sent to do the Father's will which is that EVERYONE who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life. John 6:44 in simply saying that no one is going to Heaven unless God Allows it. God wants everyone to be saved (this is backed up by other verses I'll supply if needed). John 6:45 "...EVERYONE who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me." It doesn't say "only those I choose will come to me" John 6:47 "I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life." John 6:51 "...This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world." He's saying that he will give his life for the world, not a elect group in the world. Another example, read the parable of the Lost Sheep. God didn't want any to be lost. If you need more verses about All having the opportinity for salvation, let me know. To close on, did Jesus die for everyone's sins or just some of the people? |
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86 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 470 | ||
Sorry, I thought I answered your questions. Please let me know what questions I haven't answered. By the way, I have posted may questions (and verses) asking how you would interpret them and have not received any answers. I do see that you are good at turning things around to fit what you want. Spiritually dead does not mean that a person cannot choose God. It simply means that that person is currently in a state that is not open to God. Take for example a "morally bankrupt" person or a person without morals. That doesn't mean that the person cannot choose to change his behavior to be a better person. The same goes for the Spiritally dead person. If that person hears about what Jesus can offer, they could choose to listen and believe. Yes, I'm fully aware of the meanings of "predestined" and "omniscience". I also understand that you are misapplying the term predestined to individuals being predestined rather than the correct interpretation that God's plan was predestined. The term "Elect" you mentioned somewhere is just another way of saying the believers. (today, we call them the "born-again" for example.) Also, I seriously looked into the Calvinistic belief and have talked with a "Calvinistic elder" at my church to try and see their views. Instead of just relying on what they said though, I researched the topic myself using the bible and the internet looking at it from various viewpoints (including that of the JW's). I'm sorry to say that I could not find a valid reason for interpreting the bible using the "Calvinistic Belief" or the JW's. |
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87 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 506 | ||
I see that you are the typical brainwashed person that only believes what he has been told and is afraid to examine the evidence for yourself. If you'd bother to check the previous postings you would find that I did in fact answer your questions and showed you how your took your passages out of context to twist them to your way of thinking. I also noticed that you completely disregarded most of my questions and passages that talk very explicitly about "free will". You say that you answered my verses (actually there God's verses) by arguing that mere verses are insufficient and must be accompanied by the use of Scripture as a whole in context. I showed you your verses in context and how they have nothing to do with what you pretend to be accurate. You however have not shown me A SINGLE interpretation of one of the verses I listed about how God wants all to be saved, how it's our choice to accept the Gift of Grace that God offered, how it could be possible to renounce your salvation. And as far as you saying that I have not thought much about the issues you raised could not be farther from the truth. That's the problem. I have thought a lot about the Calvinistic issues and have found that if you ignore the majority of the bible, then it holds up. Calvinists seem to think that since the Bible doesn't use the term "Free Will" then it must not exist. Unfortunatly, you also miss all the examples (new and old testiment) that talk about it as our choice. God didn't put puppets here on earth, he put living, breathing, thinking humans here that would by their own human will choose to worship Him. You would have us believe that God created us and decided who would worship him. I'm sorry, I just don't see it that way when I read the Bible and all the things it says. Of course, my bible is more than just a few verses from Ephesians and Romans. May God open your eyes and heart so that you may continue to grow. |
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88 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 80885 | ||
God loves us (everyone) whether we are saved or not - and nothing will or can stop Him from loving us - not even principalities. I'm not as strong in my opinion as to whether once saved always saved is true as I am in that God has put into motion a plan for salvation that EVERYONE can choose this plan to be saved. I don't believe that God has selected only a few ELECT people to have the opportunity to be saved. But back to once saved always saved. If that was true, why then all the warnings to guard your salvation? You mentioned Peter - What if he didn't repent but ran away instead? Same for Saul - What if he said "Hey, I'd rather be blind than to promote that Jesus thing."? God gave us the ability to choose for ourselves the path we take. While it's true that no one can take our salvation away from us, I just see to many examples in the bible that imply that we (being human) may choose to deny it and fall away - for whatever extreme reason. Some would argue that they were never saved in the first place. I would then ask those people how they know that they are truly saved then? My faith grows the more I realize that I need God. I understand (and am fully aware) that I'm not perfect and I do sin and maybe even sometimes run away from God - but I know that God still loves me and calls me His own. I'm still saved. I have always come back and never ever thought about rejecting God. But what about those people that walked and talked the path to God thru Jesus, accepted Him fully, was baptized, attended church and church funtions, witnessed to others, etc... but later because of maybe a loss of children or spouse or maybe over time because he though that he could not lose his salvation became stagnant and fell into the ways of the world and forgot about God over time and then died. Are they still saved? Truely - only God knows for sure. Keep in mind that these are my interpretations of what I read and studied from the Bible. Why we have so many different views - I don't know. All I know for sure is that God loved us so much that if He didn't do something to get us back on track we were going to end up in a big mess again. The only thing He could do that would get through our thick skulls (although some still refuse to believe) is to to become human and show us who God really is and what it really means to serve Him. Jesus died for us once and for all as a final sacrifice for our sins. No more pigeon killing. No more slaughtering of Lambs. Jesus is our new convenant with God - and just to prove it God raised Jesus so that many would witness and spread the truth so that we too would hear it through the written word. Now that I've written way more than planned, I'll end. I hope I didn't ramble on too much and sorry if I did. |
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89 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 80893 | ||
Hey Joe - long time no write. If you remember, I've answered your questions before but if you want me to, I'll do so again. To answer the new questions: --Luke 22:31-32 Jesus prayed to God that Peter be given the strength not too lose his faith (seems to imply that you can lose your faith) but it was still Peter's choice what to do with that strength. Fortunately, he accepted it and repented. We're also taught to pray specifically and as if it has already been accepted. Just as Jesus did here. --Acts 9:15-16. Yes, God chose Saul/Paul to be His instrument and because Time doesn't exist for God as it does for us, He knew that Saul would accept the mission. If Saul would have refused, I think God would have found someone else and we'd be reading about that person instead. God gave us the ability to choose our own paths. Some choose good, some bad. He wants us to choose to love Him. He doesn't want us to be "programmed" to love him automatically. Would you rather have your kids choose to love you or would you rather force them to love you (kind of like Saddam)? |
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90 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 80904 | ||
I believe you're in category (b) because you choose to accept God's gift of salvation and not because God implanted in you the idea that that's the only choice you have. Why must you diminish God's free gift to all by spouting that His gift is only for the few Elect and that other people are destined to Hell and have no chance of salvation? Why can't you see that when they talk about the Elect in the Bible, they are referring to Belivers? Why can't you see that the predestination mentioned is that, thru Jesus, all people will have access to the Kingdom of God? I assume you too have read thru the bible many times (specifically the NT) looking at what the bible is actually saying and basing your interpretations on that and not on what you've been taught by others. And when doing so, you've been brave enough to question beliefs that may differ from what you've previously thought and investigate those differences until you find a solution that incorporates the bible as a whole - posibly even changing your views. If so, then maybe God has a reason for both of us to have differing viewpoints because I have done so and still find the Elect theory to be very flawed. Maybe my eyes are just closed for some reason but until God shows me where my interpretations are wrong, I have to stick with what He's shown me so far. I wish we could actually get together sometime and sitdown for a day or 10 and pray and study the scripture together. I think we would both come out enlightened. Your friend in Christ, John |
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91 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 80933 | ||
I'm sorry to hear about your mother's passing. I'm going thru a somewhat similar problem now. My father has only a few weeks left (cancer) and thinks he is going to heaven because he went to church when he was a kid. He doesn't want anything to do with church now and does not want to talk about it. I even bought him the two Left Behind movies hoping that would spark something but he refuses to watch them. He thinks he's made his peace with God because he allowed a chruch chaplin to pray for him. I've been asked not to talk about it with him anymore. All I can do is leave it in God's hands and pray that He reaches him somehow before it's too late. Jesus did say that many will call his name but only few will be let in. I believe this to be all the "Christians" out there, like my dad, that feel that they are "saved" because they used to attend church, or their family is saved so I must be also, or say that I attend church every week so I must be saved - but the rest of the week, they forget all about Jesus. I think these people really believe they are saved but may find out otherwise when they stand before God. I think a lot of this could be prevented if all the churches had the guts to preach the full gospel - at least once in a while. (I'm not saying that they should preach fire and brimstone sermons but more explain what Jesus's death and resurrection meant for us today, how we need God's love and guidance, and how we need to live that life in today's world.) |
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92 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 80940 | ||
Thanks! I may just have to print that out and hang it on my wall. | ||||||
93 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 81022 | ||
You'll probably be banned from this forum :) |
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94 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 81023 | ||
No. He's not a Catholic. He was raised Baptist as a child - but I don't really know how often he attend church back then. He doesn't like to talk about it - now and before he had cancer. He claims to have his own God - one that allows getting drunk and watching porn. | ||||||
95 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 81034 | ||
J. I assume this was meant for "Searcher". I'm on your side here. My comment that you will probably be banned was meant as a joke. You are absolutely correct when you said that there are too many legalistic (factual) people that have to tear apart everything you say - even when you were talking (writing) to me about my father. I think a lot of people (myself included at times) forget about Jesus' love and look to the bible as our God. I'm sorry to say (actually I'm glad) that the bible is not God. It's merely a tool used to help us learn about who God really is. Like any tool, it can be abused to the point where it loses it's functionality. --John Green |
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96 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 81037 | ||
Thanks for your kind words and prayers. I'm glad there are actually some "sane" people on this forum. As far as my dad goes, I have put it into God's hands and really don't let it get too me (much). I know that God's in control and no matter what we do, think, act, say, etc.. God's Will will triumph. - John Green |
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97 | Predetermined or Free Will | Luke 8:13 | jg8ball | 81045 | ||
I guess this is something they felt that Jesus would not discuss. sadfully yours, John P.S. my father's name is also John. - Thanks. |
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98 | Not my will, but Yours be done... | Luke 22:42 | jg8ball | 70658 | ||
Joe, I would interpret this passage in the following manner: Jesus was still human at the time. It's not a sin or even a question of a conflict of wills to ask the Father for something to be done if it's within His will to do so. Jesus wasn't saying He wouldn't do it. He was saying something more like "Father, this frail body I'm in can't take much more of this and if there's any other way to achieve your plan, I'm listening. But you know I'll do whatever you desire of me." (again this is my interpretation) The statement I would make is that Jesus felt the pain and anguish of the world. He probably also knew that His death wasn't going to save everyone because there would still be some that would not choose Jesus even after all He had done. Maybe he was asking for more time to convince the people to accept Him. I don't know if anyone else would agree with me, but that's what I get out of it. Also, the verse says that His sweat was like drops of blood (not actually drops of blood). I would interpret this to mean the sweat drops were large drops falling to the ground similar to someone that just finished a marathon race or eating some really spicy food. --John |
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99 | Not my will, but Yours be done... | Luke 22:42 | jg8ball | 70746 | ||
I completely agree with you here. I believe Jesus, during His time on earth, was more human than God. He had to become human to become the perfect sacrifice for us. | ||||||
100 | Is "Paradise" the same as heaven? | Luke 23:43 | jg8ball | 334 | ||
I believe that's what Jesus was referring to. You could argue that Jesus didn't go to Heaven that day but if you believe in the Trinity then Jesus could have been talking about being in Paradise (Heaven) with God. If you don't believe in the Trinity (or don't like that explanation) then you could intrepret his statement that because he chose to believe in Jesus that day, he will be with him in Heaven. If you believe that time doesn't exist in Heaven like it does here on earth (a year is like a thousand years) then by saying today doesn't really mean much to God but it would to the dying person on the cross. | ||||||
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