Results 461 - 480 of 516
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Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: ebrain Ordered by Verse |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
461 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181410 | ||
Hi John. Thank you for your post. I think you will find that the material bellow will put the the whole matter into perspective, as these verses clearly indicate the Deity of out Lord Jesus Christ. The question should be, are you John, and others able to reconcile these apperantly opposing views of of the second person of the Trinity. For me it presents no problem, but before I let you have my thoughts, I want to see what others have to say. Subject: Jesus is God. Jesus is God, but He is also man at the same time. Have a look at Isaiah Ch 48 vs 12-16, but don't read the whole of v 16, just yet, read only, "Draw near to me, hear this: from the beginning I have not spoken in secret, from the time it came to be I have been there" (ESV). Now ask yourself, Who is speaking?, the answer can only be, the Lord our GOD, now read the rest of v 16, "And now the Lord GOD has sent me, and his Spirit." it is clear then that the one speaking in the first part of this verse must be our Lord Jesus, and none other. Read Matthew Ch 28 v 19, "in the name" not "names", one name, three persons. Now try Colossians Ch 2 v 9, "For in him the whole fullness of Deity dwells bodily" (ESV). That is to say, all there is of the Father, all there is of the Son, and all there is of the Holy Spirit dwelling inside the body of the Lord Jesus Christ. As I have said before, and will no doubt say again, don't try to understand it, just believe it, God has given you the faith to believe, so use it. The human mind is totally incapable of comprehending the Trinity, or the Deity of Jesus, so don't try. Remember "Without faith, it is impossible to please God". Better rendered as "Without exercising faith". All Scripture verses quoted are from the English Standard Version, unless otherwise stated. At John Ch 14 v 9, Jesus said "Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. John Ch 1 v 18 , reads "No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father's side, he has made him known". or "the only one, who is God"; some manuscripts "the only Son". Note, the Translator's preference is all ways shown in the main text, with possible alternative renderings relegated to footnotes as above. Now have a look at John Ch 8, vs 24, 28, and 58. Here Jesus identifies Himself three times as "I AM", not "I am he" as some Bible's put it, "he" does not appear in the original Greek. the two words are "EGO IME" and are taken from the Septuagint, a Greek translation of the OT made about 300 BC. These two words are taken from Exodus Ch 3 v 14, where God told Moses, "Say this to the people of Israel. I AM has sent me to you"... This is the most Sacred, and Holy name/description of the Lord our God it means "I HAVE BEEN WHAT I HAVE BEEN,I AM THAT/WHAT I AM, and I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE". This Title was also understood by the Jews to mean "The perpetually self revealing all existent one". It was considered so sacred by the Jews, that they were forbidden to pronounce it, when reading Scripture publicly. There was no doubt in the minds of those who heard Jesus, that He was claiming to be God. John 10:17-18. Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father. Note. Only God can raise Himself back from the dead. Who did Isaiah really see? Isa 6:1 IN the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Isa 6:2 Above it stood seraphim; each one had six wings: with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. Isa 6:3 And one cried to another and said: "Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of hosts; The whole earth is full of His glory!" Isa 6:4 And the posts of the door were shaken by the voice of him who cried out, and the house was filled with smoke. Isa 6:5 So I said: "Woe is me, for I am undone! Because I am a man of unclean lips, And I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips; For my eyes have seen the King, The LORD of hosts." John referring to this passage said. To be continued. |
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462 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181411 | ||
John referring to this passage said. Jhn 12:37 But although He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, Jhn 12:38 that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spoke: "Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed?"* Jhn 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because Isaiah said again: Jhn 12:40 "He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them."* Jhn 12:41 These things Isaiah said when* he saw His glory and spoke of Him So then just who did Isaiah see? Jhn 5:21 "For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will. Jhn 5:22 "For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, Jhn 5:23 "that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him. The Lord our God does not have a name in the sense that we have names, in order to identify/distinguish ourselves from one another. There is only one God, and for this reason no need for Him to have a name, as there is no other god with whom He might be confused. What is given in Scripture is a number of different descriptions of, His Nature, His ability, His capacity, etc, etc, What type/sort of Person He is. At Gen Ch 3 v 13. Moses said If they ask me "What is His name" what shall I say to them? The reply he received was not a name but a description. "I AM" which can also be rendered as "The perpetually self revealing all existent one". One more example, take the description EL SHADDAI, God Almighty, or "God All Sufficient", which is found 48 times in the OT. This is a compound title, made up of ELOHIM meaning the strong one who gives strength/nourishment, and the Hebrew word Shad which refers to the Female Breast. What the Lord is saying here is "I love you with the very special tender loving care that a nursing mother feels for the infant that she is breast feeding". For further information see http://www.ldolphin.org/names.html The Lord bless you all. pabrain. Below is one example of the use of EL SHADDAI. Gen 17:1 WHEN Abram was ninety-nine years old, the LORD appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. Gen 17:2 "And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly." Gen 17:3 Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: Gen 17:4 "As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. Gen 17:5 "No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. Gen 17:6 "I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. In verse 1 the Lord reveals Himself as "Almighty God", this is the English translation of EL SHADDAI. Isn't it wonderful, that when God tells Abraham who had not fathered any children, that he will be the father of many, that The Lord uses His title which is so closely related to nursing infants. Do we really have any idea just how incredible the Lord our God is? there are just no words to adequately describe Him. May the Lord bless you abundantly, and keep you safe. Edwin. |
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463 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181435 | ||
1 name a word or a combination of words by which a person, place, or thing, a body or class, or any object of thought is designated, called, or known. My user screen name, "kalos", is a Greek word which, in the KJV, is translated as "honest". My use of the word "Name", is as above, a description of a person, however, I still await your explanation of how it is that out of the mouth of one person there can come a claim to Deity (Which I accept), and a claim not to be (which I also accept) I look forward with eager anticipation to your resolution of this apparent contradiction. Let me give you a clue, have a look at John 14:10, where our Lord Jesus himself describes just what is going on. Bless you brother. Edwin. |
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464 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181440 | ||
Hi Tim. Please explain to me just what your understanding of John 5:30. is, and I will take it from there. Jhn 5:30 "I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me. |
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465 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181452 | ||
Greetings Tim. I have never said that Jesus ceased to be fully God, only that He has two natures, one which is Divine, and one which is human. Perhaps what follows will help you to understand. When Jesus came to earth some 2000 years ago, He not only came to offer Himself as a sinless sacrifice to pay for our sins, and thus enable God to forgive as many as will accept this fact. but also to demonstrate by His life just how we humans were, and are intended by our Father God to behave towards He who made us in His own image. By His life, I mean the attitude of (Not My will, but thine be done) that Jesus continually adopted towards His Father, thus enabling the Father who indwelt the Son, see Jhn 14:10 "Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works. The Father communicates Himself through the body of the man Jesus to all people with whom He came into contact at that time, and through Scripture now to us. This is the reason why you, if you are a Christian are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, in order that you might allow the other resident within yourself to have right of way in your life, and to do just what He wants to do in and through you. Remember Jesus said, "He who has seen me has seen the Father", Jhn 14:7 "If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him." not that the Father is a human being, Jesus is here referring to conduct and behavior, what He the Father did, and what He said, see Jhn 1:18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son,* who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. Jesus also said, Jhn 15:3 "You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. Jhn 15:4 "Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. Jhn 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. Note "without Me you can do nothing" Why do you suppose that Paul said Gal 2:20 "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. Phl 1:21 For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain Col 1:27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which* is Christ in you, the hope of glory. Gal 4:19 My little children, for whom I labor in birth again until Christ is formed in you, There is only one person in this whole universe who can live the Christian life to perfection,,, that person lives inside you, and that's why Jesus said what He said at, John 5:19. John 5:30, John 11:41b - 42, John 14:7-10. Ask Him in prayer, why He did things this way, and He will tell you as He told me many years ago, "Because it's the only way you can do it". Have an enjoyable holiday. Edwin. |
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466 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181453 | ||
Hi John. Below is an extract from my post. "My user screen name, "kalos", is a Greek word which, in the KJV, is translated as "honest". My use of the word "Name", is as above, a description of a person", Would you allow that the word "honest", is a description of yourself?, yes, or no Sorry to cause you confusion. Edwin. |
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467 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181454 | ||
Greetings John. Please read my post of 12.56 PM to-day to Tim Morant. Have a great holiday, and best wishes for 2007. Edwin. |
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468 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181468 | ||
Greetings Doc. What makes you think that the Biblical interpretations of fallen human beings in the 5th Century are to be preferred to those of fallen human beings in the 21st Centuary? Whenever I read Scripture, I adopt an attitude towards God as outlined at Jhn 7:17 "If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority. It is as a result of my adopting this attitude towards what I read that I believe the Holy Spirit will reveal the truth of what that passage has to convey, and that He will not confirm error. Thank you for your seasonal wishes. Edwin. |
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469 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181473 | ||
Hi Doc. Thank you for your post. As I have said many times before, I have no problem in accepting the Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ, the problem that I have is with the teaching that although Jesus was also truly a human being, He was never at any time less than God. This being the case therefore, please answer the three questions bellow. Luk 22:42 saying, "Father, if it is Your will, take this cup away from Me; nevertheless not My will, but Yours, be done." How can God say "not My will"? Jhn 5:30 "I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me. How can God say "I can of Myself do nothing"? Phl 2:9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, How can Jesus be given the name that He already has? Every blessing. Edwin. |
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470 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181480 | ||
Hi John. You have quoted. "Note: 1 John 2:27 '"You have no need for anyone to teach you." Both "you's" are plural and refer to the believing community as a whole; there is no ground here for a hyper-individualistic understanding of the Gospel wherein the views of other believers and the gathering of believers together are considered unimportant' (Jewish New Testament Commentary, David H. Stern, Jewish New Testament Publications, Inc., 1992)." Mr Stern is expressing his opinion to which he is of course entitled, however, what he has said in no way alters what I have said. The Bible is a supernatural revelation from Almighty God, it is a spiritual book, and spiritual things have to be spiritually discerned 1Cr 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. Only a born again Christian can discern what the Holy Spirit reveals, and then only if the reader adopts the same attitude that Jesus adopted at all times i.e. "not my will but thine be done". Thank you very much for your kind, and encouraging words as bellow. Subject: Could Jesus sin? Note: Edwin, Your post to Tim is a good one. And thanks for clarifying what you wrote earlier. I just didn't get it the first few times I read it, but now I do after you explained it to me. A very Merry Christmas to you! John It's a joy for me to have fellowship with you in this way. A very merry Christmas to you and your family, and all the best for 2007. Edwin. |
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471 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181487 | ||
Doc. You wrote "Relative to Philippians 2:9 you asked, " How can Jesus be given the name that He already has?" (sic) Why can't God have bestowed on Him the name eternally? Do you suppose that the Son graduated into His position at some point in time? "The Father is made of none, neither created nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made nor created, but begotten. The Holy Spirit is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding." Athanasius points out that these aspects o God are eternal, rather than temporal". I disagree, verse 9 has to be understood within the context of verses 5-9. Verse 9 starts with the word "Therefore" this clearly indicates that God also has highly exalted Him because of what Jesus did as described in some detail in verses 5-8, see bellow. Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, Phl 2:6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, Phl 2:7 but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. Phl 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. Phl 2:9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, You also wrote. "we want to take the whole of Scripture into account, not pick and choose verses to reflect our own ideas. The former is God centered, the latter is self centered". I have never at any time approached Bible reading with preconceived ideas, looking for verses to support them. I find your suggestion that I have, to be both insensitive and insulting. |
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472 | Could Jesus sin? | Col 2:9 | ebrain | 181581 | ||
I have had some further thoughts on Philipians Ch 2 vs 5-9, and would value your comments thereon, but let first let make my position clear. I have no problem with the Trinitarian nature of the Godhead, with the fact that the second person, the Son of God is just as much God as is the Father, and the Holy Spirit. Would you agree that the attitude of "not my will but thine be done" that Jesus adopted at all times towards His Father is the same attitude that we should also adopt towards our Father God at all times so that His will shall be done through us as it was through Jesus? Do you also believe that the second person of the Trinity became a real human being just as you and I are (but without sin), divesting himself of all His Divine abilities for a short period of time, in order that he should not have one iota of advantage over us, limiting himself to the same limitations that we have in order to demonstrate that we also can live a life that is well pleasing to the Lord our God, who is our Father also, and that after this short period of just a few years, that all His Divine abilities were restored to Him? Please have a look at the two translations of Philipians Ch 2 vs 5-9, given below, and let me know if you feel that my understanding of these Scripture verses is acceptable to you, and if not why. Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, Phl 2:6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, Phl 2:7 but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. Phl 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. Phl 2:9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, Phl 2:6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it an advantage to be exploited to be equal with God, Phl 2:7 but emptied himself taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. Phl 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. Phl 2:9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, Thank you. Edwin Brain. |
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473 | Explain A Normal Christian Life? | Col 3:5 | ebrain | 161447 | ||
I can strongly recommend a book entitled "The Normal Christian Life" by Watchman Nee. He also wrote "Sit Walk Stand", and another book that I think was called "What Shall This Man Do". Every blessing. ebrain. |
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474 | Explain A Normal Christian Life? | Col 3:5 | ebrain | 161457 | ||
Hi there Sheila, I can strongly recommend a book by Watchman Nee called "The Normal Christian Life", he also wrote "Sit Walk Stand", and "What Shall This Man Do?". All the above can be obtained from www.Amazon.com May the Lord bless you, and keep you safe. ebrain. |
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475 | What is apostasy? | 2 Thess 2:3 | ebrain | 187491 | ||
Hi Vincent, and thank you for your question. The Greek word from which we get "apostasy", can have more than one meaning, as the material bellow indicates, which I hope will be of help tp you. The Lord bless you. ebrain. Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, -2 Thessalonians 2:3 I believe that there is a strong possibility that 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is speaking of the rapture. What do I mean? Some pretribulationists, like myself, think that the Greek noun apostasia, usually translated "apostasy," is a reference to the rapture and should be translated "departure." Thus, this passage would be saying that the day of the Lord will not come until the rapture comes before it. If apostasia is a reference to a physical departure, then 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is strong evidence for pretribulationism. The Meaning of Apostasia The Greek noun apostasia is only used twice in the New Testament. In addition to 2 Thessalonians 2:3, it occurs in Acts 21:21 where, speaking of Paul, it is said, "that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake (apostasia)Moses." The word is a Greek compound of apo " from" and istemi "stand." Thus, it has the core meaning of "away from" or "departure." The Liddell and Scott Greek Lexicon defines apostasia first as "defection, revolt;" then secondly as "departure, disappearance."[1] Gordon Lewis explains how the verb from which the noun apostasia is derived supports the basic meaning of departure in the following: The verb may mean to remove spatially. There is little reason then to deny that the noun can mean such a spatial removal or departure. Since the noun is used only one other time in the New Testament of apostasy from Moses (Acts 21:21), we can hardly conclude that its Biblical meaning is necessarily determined. The verb is used fifteen times in the New Testament. Of these fifteen, only three have anything to do with a departure from the faith (Luke 8;13; 1 Tim. 4:1; Heb 3:12). The word is used for departing from iniquity (2 Tim. 2:19), from ungodly men(1 Tim. 6:5), from the temple (Luke 2:27), from the body (2 Cor. 12:8), and from persons (Acts 12:10; Luke 4:13).[2] "It is with full assurance of proper exegetical study and with complete confidence in the original languages," concludes Daniel Davey, "that the word meaning of apostasia is defined as departure."[3] Paul Lee Tan adds the following: What precisely does Paul mean when he says that "the falling away" (2:3) must come before the tribulation? The definite article "the" denotes that this will be a definite event, an event distinct from the appearance of the Man of Sin. The Greek word for "falling away", taken by itself, does not mean religious apostasy or defection. Neither does the word mean "to fall," as the Greeks have another word for that. [pipto, I fall; TDI] The best translation of the word is "to depart." The apostle Paul refers here to a definite event which he calls "the departure," and which will occur just before the start of the tribulation. This is the rapture of the church.[4] So the word has the core meaning of departure and it depends upon the context to determine whether it is used to mean physical departure or an abstract departure such as departure from the faith. |
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476 | What is apostasy? | 2 Thess 2:3 | ebrain | 187938 | ||
Hi Vincent. Further to my previous post, which was the first part of an article given by Dr.Thomas Ice. I only posted the first part, as I thiught it would be sufficient to show that the Greek word translated "Apostasy", can have more than one meaning, as it does not appear to have done so I am now posting the rest of this article, which has been taken from the web site. "The pre-Trib Research Center". Translation History The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either "departure" or "departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608).[5] This supports the notion that the word truly means "departure." In fact, Jerome's Latin translation known as the Vulgate from around the time of a.d. 400 renders apostasia with the "word discessio, meaning 'departure.'"[6] Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure"? Theodore Beza, the Swiss reformer was the first to transliterate apostasia and create a new word, rather than translate it as others had done. The translators of the King James Version were the first to introduce the new rendering of apostasia as "falling away." Most English translators have followed the KJV and Beza in departing from translating apostasia as "departure." No good reason was ever given. The Use of the Article It is important to note that Paul uses a definite article with the noun apostasia. What does this mean? Davey notes the following: Since the Greek language does not need an article to make the noun definite, it becomes clear that with the usage of the article reference is being made to something in particular. In II Thessalonians 2:3 the word apostasia is prefaced by the definite article which means that Paul is pointing to a particular type of departure clearly known to the Thessalonian church.[7] Dr. Lewis provides a likely answer when he notes that the definite article serves to make a word distinct and draw attention to it. In this instance he believes that its purpose is "to denote a previous reference." "The departure Paul previously referred to was 'our being gathered to him' (v. 1) and our being 'caught up' with the Lord and the raptured dead in the clouds (1 Thess. 4:17)," notes Dr. Lewis. The "departure" was something that Paul and his readers clearly had a mutual understanding about. Paul says in verse 5, "Do you not remember that while I was still with you, I was telling you these things?" The use of the definite article would also support the notion that Paul spoke of a clear, discernable event. A physical departure, like the rapture would fit just such a notion. However, the New Testament teaches that apostasy had already arrived in the first century (cf. Acts 20:27-32; 1 Tim. 4:1-5; 2 Tim. 3:1-9; 2 Pet. 2:1-3; Jude 3-4, 17-21) and thus, such a process would not denote a clear event as demanded by the language of this passage. Understanding departure as the rapture would satisfy the nuance of this text. E. Schuyler English explains as follows: Again, how would the Thessalonians, or Christians in any century since, be qualified to recognize the apostasy when it should come, assuming, simply for the sake of this inquiry, that the Church might be on earth when it does come? There has been apostasy from God, rebellion against Him, since time began.[9] Whatever Paul is referring to in his reference to "the departure," was something that both the Thessalonian believers and he had discussed in-depth previously. When we examine Paul's first letter to the Thessalonians, he never mentions the doctrine of apostasy, however, virtually every chapter in that epistle speaks of the rapture (cf. 1:9-10; 2:19; probably 3:13; 4:13-17; 5:1-11). In these passages, Paul has used a variety of Greek terms to describe the rapture. It should not be surprising that he uses another term to reference the rapture in 2 Thessalonians 2:3. Dr. House tells us: To be continued. |
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477 | What is apostasy? | 2 Thess 2:3 | ebrain | 187939 | ||
Continuation part 1. Remember, the Thessalonians had been led astray by the false teaching (2:2-3) that the Day of the Lord had already come. This was confusing because Paul offered great hope, in the first letter, of a departure to be with Christ and a rescue from god's wrath. Now a letter purporting to be from Paul seems to say that they would first have to go through the Day of the Lord. Paul then clarified his prior teaching by emphasizing that they had no need to worry. They could again be comforted because the departure he had discussed in his first letter, and in his teaching while with them, was still the truth. The departure of Christians to be with Christ, and the subsequent revelation of the lawless one, Paul argues, is proof that the Day of the Lord had not begun as they had thought. This understanding of apostasia makes much more sense than the view that they are to be comforted (v. 2) because a defection from the faith must precede the Day of the Lord. The entire second chapter (as well as 1 Thessalonians 4:18; 5:11) serves to comfort (see vv. 2, 3, 17), supplied by a reassurance of Christ's coming as taught in his first letter.[10] Departure and The Restrainer Since pretribulationists believe that the restrainer mentioned in verses 6 and 7 is the Holy Spirit and teaches a pre-trib rapture, then it should not be surprising to see that there is a similar progression of thought in the progression of verse 3. Allan MacRae, president of Faith Theological Seminary in a letter to Schuyler English has said the following concerning this matter: I wonder if you have noticed the striking parallel between this verse and verses 7-8, a little further down. According to your suggestion verse 3 mentions the departure of the church as coming first, and then tells of the revealing of the man of sin. In verses 7 and 8 we find the identical sequence. Verse 7 tells of the removal of the Church; verse 8 says: "And then shall that Wicked be revealed." Thus close examination of the passage shows an inner unity and coherence, if we take the word apostasia in its general sense of "departure," while a superficial examination would easily lead to an erroneous interpretation as "falling away" because of the proximity of the mention of the man of sin.[11] Kenneth Wuest, a Greek scholar from Moody Bible Institute added the following contextual support to taking apostasia as a physical departure: But then hee apostasia of which Paul is speaking, precedes the revelation of Antichrist in his true identity, and is to katechon that which holds back his revelation (2:6). The hee apostasia, therefore, cannot be either a general apostasy in Christendom which does precede the coming of Antichrist, nor can it be the particular apostasy which is the result of his activities in making himself the alone object of worship. Furthermore, that which holds back his revelation (vs. 3) is vitally connected with hoo katechoon (vs. 7), He who holds back the same event. The latter is, in my opinion, the Holy Spirit and His activities in the Church. All of which means that I am driven to the inescapable conclusion that the hee apostasia (vs. 3) refers to the Rapture of the Church which precedes the Day of the Lord, and holds back the revelation of the Man of Sin who ushers in the world-aspect of that period.[12] Conclusion The fact that apostasia most likely has the meaning of physical departure is a clear support for pretribulationism. If this is true, (Dr. Tim LaHaye and I believe that it is), then it means that a clear prophetic sequence is laid out by Paul early in his Apostolic ministry. Paul teaches in 2 Thessalonians 2 that the rapture will occur first, before the Day of the Lord commences. It is not until after the beginning of the Day of the Lord that the Antichrist is released, resulting in the events described by him in chapter 2 of 2 Thessalonians. This is the only interpretation that provides hope for a discomforted people. Maranatha! |
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478 | Who is he who restrains?ebrain. | 2 Thess 2:7 | ebrain | 188000 | ||
Who is he who restrains? ebrain. |
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479 | Who is he who restrains?ebrain. | 2 Thess 2:7 | ebrain | 188001 | ||
For some reason that I do not understand, the verse of Scripture that I specified, and which is shown bellow, did not appear with my question. 2 Thess 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way. My question is, "Who is he who restrains?" Thank you. ebrain. |
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480 | Who is he who restrains?ebrain. | 2 Thess 2:7 | ebrain | 188127 | ||
Every thing that is written in Scripture, must be read in context, and the context of what Paul says in verse 7 of Ch 2, must be read in view of the whole of that Chapter, and also what he had to say in his first letter to them, especially Ch 4:13-18. My attention is first drawn to verse 1 of 2 Thess 2, and "our gathering together to Him", I believe these words relate directly to, 1 Thess Ch 4:13-18, in other words the "Rapture", or it you like, our departure.. In verse 3 the word "apostsay", is used, this word can mean "falling away from", or "departing from", and in other parts of Scripture, it is used to refer to a falling away from, or a departure from the truth, however, I am convinced that here in verse 3, it means the departure of believers from earth, especially as this is what I believe Paul has in mind as seen in verse 1. It could, as some have suggested, very well be the Holy Spirit who restrains.. When the church is taken, the Holy Spirit will still be on earth. No one is able to take Him out of the way, although He might very well remove His restraint.. Note for example what He does in verses 11-12. 2 Thess 2:11 For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, 2 Thess 2:12 in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness. Regarding, "He might very well remove His restraint", have a look at the verse bellow, and my comments thereon. 1 Cor 15:28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all. The Son will not, "be subjected", as no one, but no one is able to do that, however, He certainly is able to subject Himself. ebrain. |
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