Results 21 - 40 of 77
|
||||||
Results from: Answered Bible Questions, Answers, Unanswered Bible Questions, Notes Author: alienresident Ordered by Date |
||||||
Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
21 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132323 | ||
Read this carefully, for this is God's standard of justice: "But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise. If a man hits a manservant or maidservant in the eye and destroys it, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the eye. And if he knocks out the tooth of a manservant or maidservant, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the tooth. "If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible. If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death. However, if payment is demanded of him, he may redeem his life by paying whatever is demanded." (Exodus 21:23-30) Interesting, since willfull sin causing death could not be paid by ransom, the merits of the ransom cannot be applied to Adam. I'll show you the law the states this as well if you can't find it. |
||||||
22 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132315 | ||
See my post to BradK on Wed 9/15 at 5:21 PM. | ||||||
23 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132311 | ||
Are you saying "Don't bother me with the facts?" I thought the purpose of this forum was to openly discuss Scripture that any and all could continue to gain in knowledge. Of course, this might require abandoning any wrong views we have. The Bible is like a puzzle - one piece misplaced means more are misalligned. One wrong turn could lead down a series of wrong roads. Of course, if we happen to come to a spot that we think looks nice, we may choose to stay here, even though it's not the destination we set out for. But isn't that Satan's best tactic - make us feel satisfied with how we want to serve God when perhaps we are falling short by not serving God in the way that he requires and deserves? A solid foundation of Christ will not wobble under close scrutiny of the entire Bible. Thanks for being honest, and I'll understand if you bow out of this discussion. |
||||||
24 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132310 | ||
You ask: "How do you reconcile your statement (above) with Scripture:" The prophecy at Dan 9:24-27 foretold the time of the Messiah. Thus the people were in expectation of him. (Luke 3:15) This timing is not crucial to the price of the ransom. It only serves to assist honest-hearted Jews to identify him as the true and only Messiah. Your quote in Hebrews is Paul's inspired description of Jesus' exalted position after God resurrected him. One has to start in the OT to understand divine justice. One has to understand why Adam could not be redeem by one of his offspring. I absolutely applaud God for his choice in Jesus as the ransom, and gladly cooperated with him in the role that God has now assigned him. The purpose of my discussion is to more fully understand the ransom, the we might be more fully motivated to dwell according to knowledge. |
||||||
25 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132302 | ||
The fact that Jesus is the one that volunteered to be the Christ and that God agreed to send him does not mean he the only one that could have been the ransom. Of course, once this decision was made and Jesus accomplished his father's will, there is no need of another. This was no simple matter. It involved a free-willed being submitting himself to a life of the ultimate in sacrifice to the Creator. The risk always exists, as it did with Adam, Satan and the demon angels, that God's perfect creatures might choose to stop serving him. This possibility had to exist for the Messiah to accomplish what was necessary. If just a death of a perfect man was required to exact justice for Adam's death, why the pain and suffering? If not the possibility of failure, why the pain and suffering? To answer Satan's charges and to meet divine justice, the ransom had to be a perfect human, no more and no less! This is profound truth, but yet beautifully simple. The wisdom, mercy and love in this awesome provision is motivating. We can exercise faith in Jesus' ransom, obey his teachings and prove Satan a fiendish liar too. Now, your life and mine take on true meaning and purpose. Thus the power of the truth only found in God's word. |
||||||
26 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132298 | ||
This example was not even a Jew. I'm sure you can think of numerous others. Isaiah 41:25: "I have stirred up one from the north, and he comes- one from the rising sun who calls on my name. He treads on rulers as if they were mortar, as if he were a potter treading the clay." Isaiah 44:28-45:1: "who says of Cyrus, 'He is my shepherd and will accomplish all that I please; he will say of Jerusalem, "Let it be rebuilt," and of the temple, "Let its foundations be laid. This is what the LORD says to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I take hold of to subdue nations before him and to strip kings of their armor, to open doors before him so that gates will not be shut." Ezra 1:1,2: "In the first year of Cyrus king of Persia, in order to fulfill the word of the LORD spoken by Jeremiah, the LORD moved the heart of Cyrus king of Persia to make a proclamation throughout his realm and to put it in writing. This is what Cyrus king of Persia says: 'The LORD , the God of heaven, has given me all the kingdoms of the earth and he has appointed me to build a temple for him at Jerusalem in Judah." I don't like to draw conclusions for people. I prefer to let the Scriptures speak to them in hopes that the Father will draw them. |
||||||
27 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132291 | ||
Thank you. So one would have to admit, if they believe God himself could be contained in the womb of one of his one creations, then surely he could cause the life of one of his spirit creatures to do similarly. Thus, God could have used an angel if he so chose. Why did God not create another Adam as the ransom? The answer lies in the events that lead to Adam's death. Satan had challenged God's way of ruling. He said God's withholds valuable things from his creatures. Of Job, Satan said God buys our worship and we are such disloyal creatures that we wouldn't do so otherwise! Adam was created with the same ability as spirit creatures to do what God required. Perhaps creating another Adam might cause Satan and the angels to wonder whether God had made a "new and improved" man? But to have an existing being take on human flesh, live in the physical world and keep his integrity until his sacrificial death, would not meet the requirements of divine justice, but would satisfy the issues raised by Satan's challenges. Could God himself have accomplished this? No, for he is far superior to his creation and cannot sin. Any action by Satan against God directly would be laughable. His indirect tactic was shrewd, but isn't God's wisdom awesome. In one moment, he divised a plan to vindicate his rulership and redeem Adam's descendants from a desperate plight. Why Jesus, his first-born son? He loves his creatures that much! (John 3:16) But to Jesus credit, he was fond of what his father loves. (Prov 8:31-36) Can you see why God would have such great love for his loyal son, and have given him so much authority? |
||||||
28 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132281 | ||
I want to discuss God's justice as supremely expressed in the ransom. The virgin birth of Jesus establishes that he needed to be a sinless, perfect man to begin with. The Scriptures indicate that despite repeated temptation and cruel ridicule and torture unto death, he maintained sinless - thus providing a spotless and unblemished Lamb of God as the redemption price. I am asking for the Scriptural proof that the ransom price for Adam needed to be God himself. I have supplied the evidence that it needed to be the equivalent of Adam. |
||||||
29 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132231 | ||
God has used many persons and means to save his worshipers over the centuries, but surely He is the source of salvation. Since the Messiah had to comply with God's arrangement and submit his will to that of the Father, he can rightly be called Saviour, although he himself would give all glory to God. No one seems to appreciate how superior a human created to live forever is to us. The Scriptures state clearly that another Adam was required, another sinless perfect human. That he supplied in Jesus. The correct answer to the divine requirement for the ransom could affect one's interpretation of the deity of Christ, but one must not put the cart before the horse. |
||||||
30 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132228 | ||
Luke 3:38: "the son of Kenan, the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God." Rom 5:12,18,19: "Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned-- Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men. For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous." 1 Cor 15: 21,22: "For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 1 Tim 2:5,6: "For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6who gave himself as a ransom for all men--the testimony given in its proper time." How many human lives do you think equate to the life of God? If you feel that God went above and beyond the call of justice to provide himself rather than his son a ransom, I'll accept that along with John 1:1 and 1 John 5:7 (KJ) as support. But understand, this is not perfect justice. To exercise faith in the ransom, one must know what it is - including why it was necessary. Most people know more about traffic law than they do about this most awesome legal provision. Leave trinity support aside. Does Orthodoxy even address the details of God's justice expressed in the ransom? The two topics are related I'll admit. After all, God sent his son out of love that we might not be doomed to eternal death. Who did he send? Who was he required to send? Why did he choose his son? Why not the Father himself? Why not an angel or a newly created Adam? The truth should address these questions satisfactorily. |
||||||
31 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132225 | ||
He certainly is more than a man now. The God with whom he mediates for us has exalted him and granted him authority over heaven and earth. My point is that Adam was more than you or I, thus none of his offspring could provide the ransom. Another Adam was required, thus the virgin birth. Do you see the need for equivalency in divine justice? Pay the debt Adam incurred for forfeiting his perfect life and you fix the consequences - our death. My question is: Did the ransom need to be God? Again, I can find no reason to support this. The fact that God waited thousands of years to provide the ransom actually supports his nature. We can discuss that when someone at least agrees that it is not Scripturally "necessary" for the ransom to be God. |
||||||
32 | Denounce militant Islam? | Matt 5:44 | alienresident | 132224 | ||
"Are we, as Christians, to take advise from unbelievers?" We'll do more than that if we blindly follow elected officials just because 'their authority is by God." "The context had nothing to do with electing the disciples into a political office." Since no Christians ever voted in the Bible, then none should do so today! I have never used this argument, but you seem to prefer it. |
||||||
33 | Denounce militant Islam? | Matt 5:44 | alienresident | 132221 | ||
Sorry! I should have left you out of it. | ||||||
34 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132219 | ||
Was part of the support for the trinity doctrine in the third and fourth century A.D. related to the necessity that Jesus be God in order to redeem mankind? If so, couldn't this be a case of circular referencing? Attempts to support that Jesus is God are not what is being studied here. Do the Scriptures support the idea that the ransom "had" to be God? I can find no basis for this teaching. Rather the evidence seems to speak loudly for another Adam, not God. |
||||||
35 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132218 | ||
Do you agree that the ransom became necessary the moment Adam sinned? The answer is yes, and the reason is because Adam's direct disobedience to God resulted in a death, his own - a perfect son of God. The consequences for Adam's sin cannot be overstated since his sin meant all his offspring would be born imperfect and subject to sickness and death, as well as the rebellious spirit he started. But the fact is: God's profound justice calls for "like for like." If God had so chose, he could have put Adam to death immediately and provided another Adam to die as compensation for the life the first Adam lost . You have to admit, the timing of the Messiah is not crucial to the price of the ransom. It could have come hundreds of years earlier or later, the fact that we benefit today proves this. As you quote at 1 Tim 2:5-6, the mediator was a man, but not any man. He was born sinless like the first man. This is essential to the ransom. Psalm 49:7,8 means that an imperfect man cannot redeem anyone! Thus, the price is too high. Psalm 8:5 shows that God made the first man a little lower than heavenly beings. Hebrews 2:7 applies these words to Jesus as well. I'll stop there and let you digest these thoughts. |
||||||
36 | Denounce militant Islam? | Matt 5:44 | alienresident | 132211 | ||
Tim: Respectful disagreements are a good thing. Thanks for the discussion. |
||||||
37 | Please explain this passage | Luke 16:1 | alienresident | 132202 | ||
The lesson to be drawn from the illustration is stated in verses 9-13. The steward is commended, not for his unrighteousness, but for his practical wisdom. The steward was placed in charge of the affairs of his master; it was a position of great trust. (Ge 24:2; 39:4) In Jesus’ illustration, the steward’s being dismissed meant that he was being sent out of the house, with no means of support. His lowering of the debts of his master’s debtors brought him no money but was done to win friends who might favor him in the future. One hundred bath measures of oil equaled 2,200 L (581 gal), and 100 cor measures of wheat came to 22,000 L (625 bu). The steward is within his rights in reducing the bills owed to his master, since he is still in charge of his master’s financial affairs. So by reducing the amounts, he is making friends with those who can return him favors when he loses his job. When the master hears what has happened, he is impressed. In fact, he “commended the steward, though unrighteous, because he acted shrewdly.” Indeed, Jesus adds: “The people of this world are more shrewd (wiser in a practical way) toward their own generation than the sons of the light are.” Now, drawing the lesson for his disciples, Jesus encourages: “Make friends for yourselves by means of the worldly riches, so that, when such fail, they may receive you into the everlasting dwelling places.” Jesus is not commending the steward for his unrighteousness but for his farsighted, practical wisdom. Often “people of this world” shrewdly use their money or position to make friends with those who can return them favors. So God’s servants, “the sons of the light,” also need to use their material assets, their “unrighteous riches,” in a wise way to benefit themselves. But as Jesus says, they should make friends by means of these riches with those who may receive them “into the everlasting dwelling places,” eternal life in Paradise. Since only God and his Son can receive persons into these places, we should be diligent in using any “worldly riches” we may have to support Kingdom interests and thus cultivate friendship with them. Then, when material riches fail or perish, as they surely will, our everlasting future will be assured. Jesus goes on to say that persons faithful in caring for even these material, or least, things will also be faithful in caring for matters of greater importance. “Therefore,” he continued, “if you have not proved yourselves faithful in connection with the worldly riches, who will entrust you with what is true, [that is, spiritual, or Kingdom, interests]? And if you have not proved yourselves faithful in connection with what is another’s [the Kingdom interests with which God entrusts his servants], who will give you what is for yourselves [the reward of life in everlasting dwelling places]?” We simply cannot be true servants of God and at the same time be slaves to unrighteous riches, material riches, as Jesus concludes: “No house servant can be a slave to two masters; for, either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will stick to the one and despise the other. You cannot be slaves to God and to riches.” Luke 15:1, 2; 16:1-13. |
||||||
38 | The ransom - God or man? | 1 Cor 15:21 | alienresident | 132198 | ||
Did the Messiah have to be God in order to undo Adamic sin? All Scripture dealing with the merits of Jesus ransom equate him with Adam. Is his deity required in order to effect our redemption? | ||||||
39 | Denounce militant Islam? | Matt 5:44 | alienresident | 132186 | ||
I challenge you to listen carefully to the presidential ads, and see whether or not the word "fight" is used in connection with the struggle to get elected or remain in office. Acts 5:38,39: "Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God." |
||||||
40 | Denounce militant Islam? | Matt 5:44 | alienresident | 132184 | ||
Thanks. See Tim Moran's last post. It's pretty good too. | ||||||
Result pages: << First < Prev [ 1 2 3 4 ] Next > Last [4] >> |