Results 5661 - 5680 of 6029
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Results from: Notes On or After: Thu 12/31/70 Author: DocTrinsograce Ordered by Date |
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Results | Verse | Author | ID# | |||
5661 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132418 | ||
We should never give ground quickly or easily in any area of doctrine. That is, quite possibly, a more serious problem than the original error (James 1:8). You have focused on the phrase "the traditions of men" and used it to effectively negate anything that I might say. Of a truth, I am no more interested in embracing the traditions of men than you are, Nobel. Without knowing them, how do we recognize them? Without knowing them, how do we scrutinize them in the light of scripture? If we can't do the latter, how can we know not to jettison something inspired and committed to men by God? You are very kind and loving, sir. I appreciate that very much. Those virtues are well worth emulation. Furthermore, only the fool despises rebuke. So I have carefully weighed your thoughts. I will not discount every thing you say by labeling it and denying that any of it is of God -- doing that is not of the Spirit. I will continue to "test all things, and keep that which is good." While I "study to show myself approved." We are men, we operate in the world of ideas. Although it might sound spiritual to say that we can rise above such things, that is not very rational. Ideation is a way in which God has made us like unto Himself. Reason and knowledge are not to be scorned. God is, after all, eminently rational. I am grateful and praise His name that He has not left us with no other tool than the mind. We have the all sufficient Word, His Holy Spirit, and we are new creatures. Together these are more than adequate for the renewing of our minds. Thus, our great battle is to remove the lie, no matter how disguised, and replace it with the truth. Theology has a bad connotation to many modern people. Partly, I believe, because of some of the movements in the sixties and seventies. You might recall that there was much of the division and denominationalism that you spoke about during this time. These folks claimed they had found something better. Whole new non-denominational denominations were formed, and now have grown into some of the largest churches in the land. Sir, you state that you need help practicing what Christ and His apostles taught. Won't "He who spared not His only son, give us all things unto godliness?" He has empowered us with His Spirit and with truth. The Sermon on the Mount, for example, is entirely unsuitable for the world. It is not an evangelistic message, instead it describes the regenerate follower of Christ. Look at the Pauline Epistles. Lets take Ephesians as probably the simplest example. The last three chapters contain over thirty imperative statements. I used to despair over that, complaining, "Paul, how do you expect me to keep all these rules?" I had missed the point of the first three chapters. There is not a single imperative statement in the first three chapters. They are entirely theological. Consequently, as any good American would do, I thought, "Let me get past all this fluff to the brass tacks. I want the practical stuff." What I failed to understand was that theology (what we know and think of God) always comes before obedience (how we walk in His statutes). Almost all of the Pauline epistles are structured this way: theology then practice. You have chosen well in desiring to practice what the New Testament teaches. Christ defined the kind of love we were to have when He said, "He that hath my commandments and keepeth them... loveth me." Note, however, that this was after His statement "Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free." Our freedom to apply His teachings are rooted in knowing the truth. Sir, I understand that my message is odious to many. I call us all to a disciplined life of the pursuit of holiness and the embrace of sound doctrine. God is deserving of nothing less. He has equipped us with all that we need to live such lives. It is an antinomy that He has sanctified us and yet calls us to lives of greater sanctification. However, considering what He has done for us, can we offer Him anything less than our entire, strenuous, devotion? Our entire bodies, souls, and minds? In Him, Doc |
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5662 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132401 | ||
Sir, thank you for your kind and considered words. I am quite certain that your intentions are of the very best sort. Some years ago I would have agreed with every word. I, too, felt very strongly that the mere thoughts of men were of no consequence. That I had something better in what I called "the leading of the Holy Spirit." It was a very comfortable place to be because it allowed me to discount any teaching that didn't "feel right" (which I called "discernment"). Of course, since I remained ignorant of anything that believers thought, suffered, experienced, or fought for, I was happy that I had reached the pinnacle of theological knowledge: "just Jesus and me." I said to myself, "I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing!" But I didn't know that I was "wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked." I didn't realize that what I was doing was living in the same kind of error that Gnostics espoused. Of course, I didn't know that because I didn't know what Gnostics were or what they believed. I couldn't see error, because I didn't bother to learn how Satan had deceived men in the past. I didn't even believe that I needed to diligently study the Word of God, because I thought the time had come when the Spirit would do all the teaching. Ignorance had become a crown that I wore proudly. My pastors and teachers told me how much closer to God I was for having the courage to shed all those old, musty traditions. I do appreciate what you are trying to do, sir. I have the same desire to help you! Isn't that why we are here in this forum... to learn and help others learn the truth of God? The truth of God is ageless. We in the Reformed Baptist tradition do not think that the truths of the doctrines of grace grew from the mind of Paul, Augustine, Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, Whitfield, Toplady, Edwards, Spurgeon, Lloyd-Jones, Schafer, or MacArthur. No, we believe that they originated entirely in the mind of God, before the foundation of the world. That truth spans ages. Do I find my identity in truth? Yes, sir I do. For truth is dear to the heart of my Savior, so how cannot it not be dear to my own heart? It is late for me again. I must sign off more quickly than I would have preferred. We will talk again. Deuteronomy 32:7 Remember the days of old, consider the years of many generations: ask thy father, and he will shew thee; thy elders, and they will tell thee. |
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5663 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132397 | ||
I was not referring to anything specific, Brother Tim. Today there is a tendency to compromise truth for peace or unity. I can broadly describe some of these false teachings that are too frequently tolerated. Fundamentally they would include anything contrary to the following: 1. The Bible (66 books of the canon) alone is the ultimate authority, fully containing the will of God, and are fully sufficient to a man for salvific purposes. That all writings of men are inferior to the divine scriptures. That neither custom, multitudes, antiquity, succession of times or persons, theories, councils, decrees, or statutes are always of inferior value to the Word of God. (Psalm 119:18; 138:2; II Timothy 3:14-17) 2. That all of life is to be lived under the Lordship of Jesus Christ. Every activity of the Christian is to be sanctified to the glory of God. (1 Corinthians 10:31; 1 Peter 4:11; Revelation 1:6; 7:12; 2 Peter 3:1; Ephesians 3:21; Romans 11:36) 3. That Jesus Christ is the sole mediator between God and man. Christ having stepped in and taken the punishment and judgment that was due sinners. With His own blood He expiated the sins that made these sinners enemies of God, fully satisfying Him. Christ alone is the source of divine favor and fatherly love. (1 Timothy 2:5-6; Colossians 1:13-18) 4. The regenerate's righteous standing before God is imputed by grace because of the work of Christ Jesus our Lord and not by any self-merit. Christ's sacrifice for them made a proper, real, and full satisfaction to God's justice on their behalf. That justification is only of free grace to and for God's great glory. (Ephesians 1:3-8) 5. That this salvific faith, resting wholly on Christ and His righteousness, is the sole instrument of justification. It is not alone in the regenerate, but is accompanied by good works done in love (though these deeds do not justify). (Galatians 3:6-11) I'd also include any doctrine contrary to the Nicene Creed. |
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5664 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132254 | ||
Hi, Nobel... That was very well said! You have covered a lot of ground here. I appreciate your kind interest in my thoughts. I will do my best to present them clearly. I agree that we seek comfortable places. Isn't this just the nature of the flesh? I emphatically and enthusiastically agree with your statement about regarding such fleshly comforts being "inimical to a search for truth." You have stated this very well! For quite some time I have noticed this in my own life. Since the flesh is at war with the Spirit, the nearer I get to the things of the Spirit, the more uncomfortable I've become. It is so much easier to stay in my comfort zones! However, I've learned to use that discomfort -- and it is easy to recognize its source -- as indication that I'm heading in the right direction. (Of course, I don't mean this dogmatically. Excuse me, but it is getting late and I want to get this posted. Having spent the evening on a previous post, I need to hasten... but probably it will cost in terms of clarity on this post!) When I come to a passage of scripture that just doesn't "fit," causing me discomfort, I rejoice. Because that means I have found the perimeter of my own understanding. At that moment I am standing on the edge, and I have an opportunity to push the envelope. Now, when I speak of "traditions" I do so as a generic term for what you have called our norms and divisions. Terminology is extremely valuable for the purposes of communication. Much of the educational process (there's that word again!) of the believer is learning the language of Christianity. We must learn the terms of scripture, which include words like grace, faith, love, hope, etc. etc. None of which mean to believers what they mean to the world. Many errors in church history have stemmed from improper definitions. Ours is a very cerebral faith. We encouraged to study, learn, judge, test, examine, discern, etc. Words, therefore, are extremely important. So important, in fact, that God has provided us with a revelation that consists of a set of words... and He calls it The Word. God, in His great grace and mercy has not left us alone. He is given us the Holy Spirit to assist in this endeavor. Indeed, without the efficacious work of the Spirit, we could not begin to understand God's Word. Now, God has also given us fellow believers. Together we can worship Him and deliberate over His word. Each of us coming together in such a way that we are greater than the sum of our parts. Each with a unique perspective of the God Who by His own action has specifically and miraculously chosen and saved each one of us. Ephesians chapter two talks about how God has brought us together into one Temple... a Temple made without hands. Incredible. I'm sorry... but it is lightening outside... time to shutdown my machine... I've lost too many of them to thunderstorms! :-) Sorry for slapping this together! |
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5665 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132251 | ||
Constructing doctrine is a very serious business. I understood your comments to indicate that extrapolating doctrine from Biblical narratives was a valid method for you in your tradition. It is not acceptable within the context of my own tradition. (Kalos knows very well the principles of which I am speaking.) Thus, when I wrote to him I started thinking about presuppositional and hermeneutic differences. Hence the phrase "faced with others who do not apply those principles." Ed, you have pastored in many churches: Don't you find that a lot of people just don't think about such things? Or they don't know how to talk about them? Or they believe things without knowing why? Sir, my feet are clay. I have probably sinned more in my lifetime than you have imagined doing in your own. There is absolutely nothing good in me that wasn't specifically put there by a God, Who, in spite of my worthlessness, chose to show mercy on me. There are so many logs in my own eyes that I would never even imagine the few motes in your own. My roots grow out of a long line of God haters; men who studiously and strenuously -- and I mean that quite literally -- sought to do all possible damage to Christianity. I am quite certain that you -- personally and professionally -- have done far more for the kingdom of God than I could have done in twice as many lifetimes. Furthermore, the doctrines of grace, if they teach us nothing else, are so incredibly humbling that they brook nothing in the way of self righteousness. If I now know anything of God and His Word, it has grown out of a walk through fire, and God's boundless mercy and grace. Sir, I do not know the root cause of your sensitivity toward me. Perhaps it comes from my inability to happily accept heresy and apostasy as suitable bed-fellows with the truth. Perhaps it comes from my screen name. Perhaps it is something else entirely. I do not know. But I do know this: your sensitivity is causing you to feel offense when none is intended. I have prayed and searched my conscience as I composed this post. In summation, therefore, let me say without ranchor or umbrage of any kind: Our struggle with sin is difficult at best. Sir, I respectfully submit that the Kingdom of Heaven is not furthered by the manufacture of more sin. |
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5666 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132234 | ||
Thank you, ma'am. I rather thought that you might be speaking in common terms, but I was curious. Thank you for explaining! Actually, I have noticed this same sort of "drawing" in my own life. In that sense there is a process that is only visible looking back over the past. From my own theological tradition I would call this an aspect of "electedness" (if there were such a word). :-) What we are talking about is expressed well by Francis Thompson in the poem "Hound of Heaven." (Though I find parts of it more poetic than soundly doctrinal.) Tying both of these topics (conversion and preaching) together: Unfortunately, among Baptist circles, we have been guilty of leading people to believe that saying a prayer, or walking an aisle, or some such thing is a kind of first step. Then, if you want to get serious about God, get baptized. Then, if you really want to be holy, sit in the front row and come to church every time the door is opened. Then, if you are even more serious about God, become a Sunday School teacher. Then, if you are even more interested in Godly things, become a deacon. Then, if you want to be really out there, become a preacher. But if you want to be super holy, become a missionary! I have searched the scriptures and I do not find this kind of optional behavior. I am bought with a price. I can do nothing but fall at the foot of the throne and cry out "I am but a dead dog!" What else is there but full submission to such an incredible Sovereign Lord! To mix love of self with worship of such an awesome Savior is to end up with nothing left but the filthy rags of self. I must come to Him through that narrow gate. Anything else is offering strange fire. Sorry... I do go on, don't I? :-) Thank you, again, for your comments. |
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5667 | An Admission of an Atheist | Ps 53:1 | DocTrinsograce | 132147 | ||
My favorite is the one: "An agnostic is a person who says they know nothing of God, and then get angry at you when you agree with them." :-) | ||||||
5668 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132146 | ||
I agree, Brother Kalos. Those are the rules of thumb that I follow, and are well defined in our tradition. Faced with others who do not apply those principles when deriving doctrine, I was curious to know what rules they do apply. Based on the answers I am getting back, it appears that either they do not have any rules, they are unable to articulate them, or they simply do not know how their doctrines were derived. I was not asking as a point of contention, but more out of curiosity. I think this might be a good time to post some of the principles of proper textual interpretation. The funny thing about those rules, is that they are not unique to Biblical hermeneutics. They are used every day in our legal system for the interpretation of any given document. Of course, the lawyers -- having once received a seminary degree in the early days of our country -- may well have borrowed these techniques. Sorry... too many rabbit trails here! |
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5669 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132107 | ||
Another question: If it is acceptable in your tradition to derive doctrines from narrative, then how do you know when you've gone too far? For example, Matthew 19:17 Christ says to the rich young ruler that to be saved he must "keep the commandments." I do not think that you would use this as an example of how to evangelize. But how do you prevent that kind of error? | ||||||
5670 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132106 | ||
Take it easy, Brother Ed... calm, rational, discussion of the Word can yield rich rewards. If I do not ask questions, how will I come to a clearer understanding of your position? Let me explain my statement regarding doctrine. In my tradition we believe that God gave us didactic scriptures to explain the narrative. Titus 1:9 and other places suggest that sound doctrine always has its basis in instruction. If you base your conversion-as-a-process doctrine solely on the example of Peter, it is really okay. I honestly do not mind ... nor do I think less of you. I was just hoping that there was more to it than that. Soteriology fascinates me. I don't think we can plumb the depths of the subject. I am well aware that your traditional roots differ from my own. I do not expect our views to be identical. Perhaps that is why your thoughts interest me so much. Furthermore, I was not taking exception to what you had posted. I was just trying to gain greater clarity. For example, we have other narrative examples (Zacchaeus, Paul, and others) of sudden conversions. How do these fit your exegesis? Now, if you can relax a little bit, perhaps you will be kind enough to answer my questions. I promise you that I am not trying to bait you. |
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5671 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132103 | ||
"I do pray I did not put words into WalkingTalkingBible’s mouth." Ummmmm... There was an easy way to have insured that that prayer would have been answered affirmatively. :-) (I'm just teasing you, bro!) Your example of Peter, though Biblical, is rendering doctrine from a narrative incident. Do you -- and/or perhaps others -- have any additional scriptures to support this procedural view of soteriology? Regarding preaching, I agree with your evaluation of much of what passes for preaching in American churches today -- though I think we would agree that it is not what is meant in scripture by the word. I do have another question: If John 7:7, 15:18, and 1 Peter 2:8, how can preaching of the Word be made more loving? Thank you, brother Ed, for your thoughts. I continue to look forward to WalkingTalkingBible's response. |
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5672 | Rowdy, Rowdy, are you sure? | 1 Tim 2:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132092 | ||
Ma'am, I am not arguing your point. However, I am curious. (1) On what scriptures do you base the conclusion that "conversion is a process?" (2) If Romans 10:17 and Romans 10:14, how can the reduction of preaching cause "more souls" to be "drawn to God?" Hopefully I have understood your statements and have faithfully reproduced your position. Thank you... I look forward to your response. (Forensic Scientist: Cool!) |
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5673 | Does this mean they do not go to heaven? | Rom 8:9 | DocTrinsograce | 132007 | ||
Hi, Brother Ed... I wouldn't be surprised at that percentage. I wanted to say, though, that I appreciate your comments on mentoring. This does seem to be the example we are given in scripture. We should each be mentoring someone and have a mentor ourselves. Thank you, Ed, for reminding us of this. | ||||||
5674 | An Admission of an Atheist | Ps 53:1 | DocTrinsograce | 132006 | ||
Anecdote time again: I have a friend in Germany who is an atheist. I remember him saying once that he didn't want to believe that God existed. When I asked why he said, "if God exists then man would be obligated to Him." (In my experience atheists do not generally recognize this fact.) Of course, I still find it interesting that truth rarely enters into the equation for people like this. |
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5675 | Do all men belong to God? | Job 33:6 | DocTrinsograce | 132004 | ||
Hi, Mom... I didn't say anything, I just quoted a verse. Clearly God doesn't make men wicked, but God does make wicked men. Indeed, we are all wicked until He saves us. | ||||||
5676 | Seize the Day | Eccl 11:9 | DocTrinsograce | 131904 | ||
At the bottom of my correspondence I have in tiny, italicized letters the Latin phrase, "Carpe diem coram Deo." Which means, "Seize the day before the face of God." This Latin phrase and this verse seem to capture the theme of Ecclesiastes. We must take full advantage of this gift of time, but in all that we do we must always be cognizant of the fact that our every act is fully manifest to the Lord, the Righteous Judge. | ||||||
5677 | Scriptural evidence? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131882 | ||
Yes, it differs there, but only because the Westminster catechism is simply a reaffirmantion of orthodoxy dating back through Augustine and ultimately Paul (1 Tim 4:1-3, Titus 1:9) This is another area in which you are highly senstive, brother Ed... In respectful deference to that sensitivity and your senior position to me, I will no longer respond to this thread. :-) |
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5678 | Scriptural evidence? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131879 | ||
Numbers of adherents to a truth do not count. Evangelistic fruit, changed lives, are always an indication of where God is moving. So the Presbyterian Cho is Pentecostal? That is like saying the Baptist Joe is Roman Catholic. :-) Whatever, Ed... Wisdom is justified by her children. |
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5679 | Have you ever read a book by a Catholic? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131878 | ||
Up until this last post, I have seen all three of those logical fallacies applied in posts from Dalcent, and I have not been bothering to follow all that he has posted. I was under the impression that you were supporting his position. Charles Chiniquy had a great burden for those whom he regarded as enslaved by Rome. I had heard of his belief that the Pope was behind the murder of Abraham Lincoln. I am not easily persuaded in the acceptance of conspiracy theories. I am, however, very saddened when I hear from my friends in Germany regarding the Vatican's support of certain leaders there during the 20's through the 60's. Regardless, Chiniquy and Fox (not just their critics) should be read by everyone, lest we forget that our Lord is not served by Machiavellian intolerance. |
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5680 | Scriptural evidence? | Bible general Archive 2 | DocTrinsograce | 131877 | ||
Let us pray that an insastiable hunger for holiness and the Word would sweep our ranks, no matter the pew in which we sit. | ||||||
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